Do you think America is Babylon?

[Nimrod's Apprentice]

I am a strong believer that this is true. Although I would not consider myself a devout Ras Tafari. Their views of spirituality and their accounts of the Bible, the Prophets, and History are fascinating and seem more possible than any other religion ive encountered in my quest. Yet back to the question DO YOU THINK AMERICA with its devout Materialism is Babylon reborn? When money is god to 80% of the people Ive ever met, I tend to think so. AND the lord GOD shall strike down Babylon. FOr she is the mother of all harlots, I believe the saying goes. Nimrod shall not steal our freedom again threw his trickery.

[prophet7]

I and I do not think - I and I know that Amerikkka is Babylon.

One Love
Prophet7

[Nimrod's Apprentice]

Yea so how do we let the truth prevail. If we can't chant down babylon, then how do we escape her wickedness. One love is right my friend.

[jimiman42]

It is more the western train of thought, the western lifestyle, that is Babylon reborn, because the concepts and principles that make america such a terrible place exist elsewhere as well (though they are much stronger here). The west is based on material excess, and is all about finding the "easier way to enlightenment," even if it means casting one's heritage, history, and rituals aside. This descends directly from babylon, and the Tower of Babel. Seeing as america is the capital of western society and "advancement," if one place were to be called babylon reborn, this would undoubtedly be it.

[Nimrod's Apprentice]

Yea im aware of Babylonian Ideals, and that they come straight from Ancient Babylon. I have two questions now.

The world trade center. In the bible the Tower of babel was a place of commerce, and due to its corruption and potential dangerous power god confused the languages of man, so they could no longer understand or live side by side with each other. I now refer to the World Trade Center as the Twin Towers of Babel. One world united under currency can never work.

How do we return to Zion? Where do I find information of the lifestyle during the golden age before Nimrod and Babylonian and cities, and materials, and living hells, and demons possessing men. I want to go back, and I would take the world with me if it saved them.

[JesusDiedForU]

As a Christian, I believe America is Babylon based on the descriptions of Jeremiah 50 and 51 and Revelation 18. I had just written a research paper on this topic. You would be suprised in how many Christian theologians believe this theory. The Babylon descriptions fit no other nation but AMERICA.

[Art Delfo]

As a Christian, I believe America is Babylon based on the descriptions of Jeremiah 50 and 51 and Revelation 18. I had just written a research paper on this topic. You would be suprised in how many Christian theologians believe this theory. The Babylon descriptions fit no other nation but AMERICA.
Yup listen to this

in the bible it says the king of Babyon had a dream where he saw an idol
The idol had a golden head which represented his kingdom
it had a ......I think a steel chest but im not sure which repersents the Med-Persian kingdom which would destroy his kingdom
it had copper(i think not sure) waist that reperesented Greace under the rule of Alexander the great who destroyed the Med-Persian kingdom
then it had iron legs wich repersented the Roman Empire who beat Alexander the Great(and killed Jesus)
and then it had clay feet which repersentes America/England
Then he drempt that god took a stone and threw at the feet and the idol fell to the ground broken.

Dont belive me look in the book of Danlie(Misspelled:p )

[sm0key42o8]

I and I know this to be true.

Jah bless and One Love

[ElChivato]

i and i know this to be true as well.
btw, smokey, i love ur siggy. "war" is definitely one of my fave Bob Marley songs.
jah bless,
pakalolo

[Chodpa]

I an I speak alot for Jah. But I an I should let Jah do the speaking. Babylon the whore is Iraq where all the nations have gone to fornicate, and have left a wasteland.

[ryupower]

Babylon (in the Bible) refers to a revived Roman empire...it seemed like you wanted an answer like this. But no, I don't believe it's america. I believe it's got something to do with the Pope. ('the whore of Babylon will wear ambellishes of Gold, and Robes of Purple and scarlet' hmmm...that's the cardinal/Pope's colors. And the 'whore that sits on 7 hills'...So does Rome! the Vartiken.)

Sorry if this is not the answer you're looking for, but it sounds like it...

[Zion]

Check it babylon resides with each man, as long a he can hold hatred or take life for granted. Zion is infinite appreciation to JAH. Babylon is the moment where a human takes the life JAH gave them for granted see

[JesusDiedForU]

Babylon (in the Bible) refers to a revived Roman empire...it seemed like you wanted an answer like this. But no, I don't believe it's america. I believe it's got something to do with the Pope. ('the whore of Babylon will wear ambellishes of Gold, and Robes of Purple and scarlet' hmmm...that's the cardinal/Pope's colors. And the 'whore that sits on 7 hills'...So does Rome! the Vartiken.)

Sorry if this is not the answer you're looking for, but it sounds like it...
FROM A PAPER I WROTE LAST YEAR:

Coombes says today the most popular theory of the identity of Babylon is modern day
Rome (1). Coombes stated this view goes back to when John first wrote Revelation but later died after Christianity became the dominant force in world interactions (1). However, Coombes declares the theory of Rome later resurrected in the 1800’s when it was thought that the Harlot of Revelation 17 was the Catholic Church, and the city described in Revelation 18 was the revived Roman Empire (1). To this day, this theory is what many theologians believe that Rome will once again become a world power (1). Dave Hunt, author of A Woman Rides the Beast, tells the two main reasons for this theory. First, in Revelation 17:9 Babylon is described as a city that sits on seven hills and Rome also literally is built on seven hills (1). Second, in Revelation 17:6 and 18:24 Babylon is described as a city that persecutes prophets and saints so it is concluded that this is a clear reference to the Roman Inquisitions (11). With these descriptions in mind Dave Hunt and many other theologians have reasoned that the Catholic Church, specifically the Vatican, is what John is describing in Revelation (2).
In response, Carl E. Olson, author of the article “The Time is Near: Five Common Misinterpretations of the Book of Revelation,” says that although the Vatican is on hill, it is not one of seven hills that Rome sits on. The seven hills that Rome is built on are located east of Tiber River where as the Vatican hill is to the west (Olson 4). Also, in regards to the persecution of the saints, 18:24 states, “And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.” R.A. Coombes, author of Alpha and Omega Report, an online prophecy magazine, raises the question, how can Rome be punished for all the people of the Earth (1)? The magazine brings up the point, that it is not a matter of who killed the prophets and saints but accountability for all that have been killed (4). Simply put, God will center his entire wrath on this one empire for all that have been killed even though Babylon is not responsible for all the murders of the earth. Jeremiah 51:49 explains that Babylon is found guilty because it has “caused the slain of Israel to fall, so at Babylon shall fall the slain of the earth” (4).

Also, in the book United States in Prophecy by Edward Tracy, Rome is considered the place where the Antichrist will emerge and form his empire, but Babylon is completely separate from it. For it is pictured in Revelation 14 through the second and third angel that Babylon will be destroyed before the Beast comes to power (76). Therefore, although Rome does play a major part in the end times it is completely separate from Babylon because Babylon is destroyed before Rome and the antichrist comes to power. Yet, this explanation is the least of the problems for the people that hold to the Rome theory. Ultimately, the descriptions of Babylon do not match the description of modern day Rome nor will they ever. For example, S. Franklin Logsdon author of Is the U.S.A in Prophecy? explains that Babylon is described as the youngest country. One of these descriptions is found in Jeremiah 50:12: “Behold the hindermost of nations shall be a wilderness, a dry land, and a desert.” The key word in this passage is “hindermost” (28). Dictionary.com describes hindermost as “Farthest to the rear; last.” In other words, Babylon is the last country to be established. America became officially a nation in 1776 and is the youngest country today, whereas the city of Rome was not established until the middle of the fourth century (Tracy 26).

[NatureFreak412]

yes it is babylon

[Loveee]

Check it babylon resides with each man, as long a he can hold hatred or take life for granted. Zion is infinite appreciation to JAH. Babylon is the moment where a human takes the life JAH gave them for granted see
I and I think this man gots it right.

See America is only an outer representation of whats going on in the bald-heads Babylonian mind, see? If he had a clean mind America would become Zion. Its all in your head, eyes open or closed.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

Not just America would I consider Bablyon...any country that deals in oppressing and enslaving of Africa's children would I consider Babylon...Netherlands, America, UK, Germany...Colonisation is the root of evil, not a country, and the people who only love money is cause they have not found Jah.

[JesusDiedForU]

Not just America would I consider Bablyon...any country that deals in oppressing and enslaving of Africa's children would I consider Babylon...Netherlands, America, UK, Germany...Colonisation is the root of evil, not a country, and the people who only love money is cause they have not found Jah.
Isaiah 13

A Prophecy Against Babylon

5 They come from faraway lands,
from the ends of the heavens—
the LORD and the weapons of his wrath—
to destroy the whole country.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

Would this verse in the Bible not actually be revering to Babylon...the place? Like the world power, enslaved all of Isreal's children...and if you are reading some sort of prophecy against Bablyon today into this verse, it's not very clear as to what it is!

[JesusDiedForU]

Would this verse in the Bible not actually be revering to Babylon...the place? Like the world power, enslaved all of Isreal's children...and if you are reading some sort of prophecy against Bablyon today into this verse, it's not very clear as to what it is!
This is true the Babylon spoke in Isaiah 13, Jeremiah 50 & 51, and Revelation 18 is not the literal ancient Babylon found in modern day Iraq. Infact, it is a future empire that is why it is spoken of in the book of Revelation. Here are a few qualifications of this future Babylon

Babylon dwells on many waters, and has abundant treasures. (Jeremiah 51:13)
Babylon is a land filled with people from other lands and is a land of mingled people. (Jeremiah 50:16) (Jeremiah 50:37 )

When Babylon is destroyed, her great voice will be silenced. (Jeremiah 51:55)

God addresses the Jews living in Babylon. (Jeremiah 51:45 to 50) (Revelation 18:4)
The merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. (Revelation 18:3)

Babylon glorifies herself. (Revelation 18:7)

The nations stream to Babylon. (Jeremiah 51:44)

Babylon is described as a country. (Isaiah 13:5)

Babylon has a mother (Jeremiah 50:12)

[FunkyPhreshMama]

First, I apologize for not quite veling able to quote all the different arguments in one, but here I go (please remember, I do welcome you, since you seem to have some intense and intelligent arguments to bring.

Babylon dwells on many waters, and has abundant treasures. (Jeremiah 51:13)

When Bablyon was brought down, by the Persians (if I remember correctly, you must apologize, but I do not have a Bible right of hand) used the river that flowed through Bablyon, so I do believe that this verse refers to the actual Bablyon.

Babylon is a land filled with people from other lands and is a land of mingled people. (Jeremiah 50:16) (Jeremiah 50:37 )

Bablyon was known to keep the most intelligent and smartest of all conqured people, and letting them practice their Faith, as well as letting all people live as free people, until it came to them leaving, but also letting them keep their native tonque.

I do believe that the bible has soom references to the modern Bablyon, but I also believe that Man must be careful not to be tricked by reading to much into the word of Man...But I do have the out most respect for you to do research for your project.

Jah Bless...Love Heile Selassie I.

[JesusDiedForU]

First, I apologize for not quite veling able to quote all the different arguments in one, but here I go (please remember, I do welcome you, since you seem to have some intense and intelligent arguments to bring.

Babylon dwells on many waters, and has abundant treasures. (Jeremiah 51:13)

When Bablyon was brought down, by the Persians (if I remember correctly, you must apologize, but I do not have a Bible right of hand) used the river that flowed through Bablyon, so I do believe that this verse refers to the actual Bablyon.

Babylon is a land filled with people from other lands and is a land of mingled people. (Jeremiah 50:16) (Jeremiah 50:37 )

Bablyon was known to keep the most intelligent and smartest of all conqured people, and letting them practice their Faith, as well as letting all people live as free people, until it came to them leaving, but also letting them keep their native tonque.

I do believe that the bible has soom references to the modern Bablyon, but I also believe that Man must be careful not to be tricked by reading to much into the word of Man...But I do have the out most respect for you to do research for your project.

Jah Bless...Love Heile Selassie I.
What about babylon having a mother?... Here is what I think, I will just tell you straight forward because I don't feel like leading you with clues : ) I believe along with a handful of theologians believe that the Babylon of Isaiah 13, Jeremiah 50&51, and Rev. 18 is AMERICA... please tell me your thoughts : )

[FunkyPhreshMama]

As far as Isahiah 13 goes, it would be just a little strange that Isaiah just happened to live in Bablyon, and had a vision that did not fortell the destruction of the Bablyon that was holding Jah's choosen people, but instead he saw the falling of a Babylon 4000 years later. Doubtfull...
As far as Jeremiah, I could throw doubt on that, as in Jeremiah 50:2, it says Bel was put to shame...yea, that was Babylon's Great God...not America, and just the same, it says all of the idols, now, where America most common Religion is Christanity, I would not say that it's Catholic, which is the Christian Faith with the most use of Idols. Fruthermore, Jeremiah writes that a great Force from the north will come...come on, Canada is great, takes care of it's people, but a great force? And Bablyon (Which was in Iraq) was conquered by the Persians (WHICH ARE FROM THE NORTH)...

The only one that I could agree with you, would be Revelations 18, since when Apostol John had this vision, Babylon (the actual world power) had been destoyed already. But if I remeber correctly from my times of Bible Study, the current World Power, Anglo-America, which is Great Britian and America, is refered to, I'm sorry, I can't remember which, either a Great Lion with two Heads or a Big Lizard thing with two heads, but I'm almost certain that it was the lion. But anyways, if I remember correctly, Bablyon the Whore, as which she is refered to in Revelations, is all False Religons.

[JesusDiedForU]

Altough Christiananity is the main religion of America, it is only a handful that actually trully believe with their hearts that Jesus is God--therefore TRUE CHRISTIANS. America is only a Christian nation by label.

In regards to a nation from the North, in Ezekiel 38, God speaks of the ancient tribes of Meshech and Tubal and of their leader Gog. Although these ancient tribal names are not common today, it is important to understand that these tribes settled in the land that we recognize as Russia. So, when the Bible speaks of Gog, understand that God is identifying and talking about Russia. In the Old Testament, God says that Gog will assemble a massive and mighty army that will invade Israel in the latter years. In Ezekiel 38:9, He tells us that this invading army will be so large, that they will be like a "cloud to cover the land." Also, God said Gog would come from the "utter most north." By looking at a world globe, one can see that the only nation to the utter most north of Israel is Russia. Bible scholars knew that Gog was Russia years before Israel even became a nation. One can verify this by picking up a Scofield Bible from 1900. Curiously enough, by drawing a straight line north from Jerusalem on a globe, the line perfectly intersects Moscow. Do not be fooled by Russia and their present passive government. They are only the calm before the storm. Evil war like leaders will be coming back into power. The Bible demands it.

Gog attacks Israel and Gog attacks Babylon (America)

[JesusDiedForU]

here is a good website by a theologian,

http://www.americathebabylon.com/exerpts.shtml

[FunkyPhreshMama]

alright, your doing the typical christian thing...talking in circles, insisting that you are right, and only your interpertation of the bible counts...and with you views, your Screen name and everything, why are you in the rasta thread? Christanity was part of the colonization, so you are part of Babylon!!!

[JesusDiedForU]

alright, your doing the typical christian thing...talking in circles, insisting that you are right, and only your interpertation of the bible counts...and with you views, your Screen name and everything, why are you in the rasta thread? Christanity was part of the colonization, so you are part of Babylon!!!
I post what I believe. If you disagree with it, then tell me why. Perhaps we can both learn in our discussion.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

well, I answered every question that you have thrown at me, including looking up verses as different as Isahiah to Revelations, which you have tied together in some strange way, followed by more strange verses that you believe ties russia into the whole picture...all i can tell you is that, yes, maybe you believe in some way that America is Babylon, but out of a Rastafarian view, not just america is babylon...any place or belief or government that oppresses and enslaves it's people, is Babylon...The U.S. during slave years, china and tibet, russia and the Chechen Rebels, Great Britian and Ireland, some religions, like the christians that teach fire and brim stone...fear is not the answer...terror does not work and you shall not confuse Jah's true believers with what you try to read into a Scripure that has been translated so many times by so many different people that were part of Bablyon...No False Prophets!!!!

[JesusDiedForU]

well, I answered every question that you have thrown at me, including looking up verses as different as Isahiah to Revelations, which you have tied together in some strange way, followed by more strange verses that you believe ties russia into the whole picture...all i can tell you is that, yes, maybe you believe in some way that America is Babylon, but out of a Rastafarian view, not just america is babylon...any place or belief or government that oppresses and enslaves it's people, is Babylon...The U.S. during slave years, china and tibet, russia and the Chechen Rebels, Great Britian and Ireland, some religions, like the christians that teach fire and brim stone...fear is not the answer...terror does not work and you shall not confuse Jah's true believers with what you try to read into a Scripure that has been translated so many times by so many different people that were part of Bablyon...No False Prophets!!!!
It may have been translate many times... but there is only one author to start with and that is God JHVH. Last time I checked the Dead Sea scrolls confirmed the Bible we had today... atleast the ones that were not tortered to fit their personal belief system.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

which bible are you refering too? The bible that teaches us the the christian god is all loving but willing to destroy all live on earth with a flood, but save a family in a wooden box??? i think not, and i thought from your first few posts that you were to intelligent to be fooled with a few STORIES! bt anyway...nd only one author? i could have sworn that the first 4 books in the bible were written by moses, followed by a few others, then luke, john, and the other clownes, followed alot by pauls books....nah...it man's words claiming to be influenced by Jah!

[JesusDiedForU]

which bible are you refering too? The bible that teaches us the the christian god is all loving but willing to destroy all live on earth with a flood, but save a family in a wooden box??? i think not, and i thought from your first few posts that you were to intelligent to be fooled with a few STORIES! bt anyway...nd only one author? i could have sworn that the first 4 books in the bible were written by moses, followed by a few others, then luke, john, and the other clownes, followed alot by pauls books....nah...it man's words claiming to be influenced by Jah!
Yes it was written by many men... however they were inspired by the father... Answer me this, can mere men predict the future with detail?

[FunkyPhreshMama]

it seems like this...what has been prophecied that WITHOUT doubt can be considered true? like that jesus would be an offspring of david? then why is it that in matthew 1:12 and luke 3 it shows that actually joseph is the offspring of david, not jesus...so that could mean two things then, huh? either jesus is merelly a man, or not the messiah...

[JesusDiedForU]

it seems like this...what has been prophecied that WITHOUT doubt can be considered true? like that jesus would be an offspring of david? then why is it that in matthew 1:12 and luke 3 it shows that actually joseph is the offspring of david, not jesus...so that could mean two things then, huh? either jesus is merelly a man, or not the messiah...
OR Marry was the biological offspring and Joseph was legal offspring. Also there are prophecies that are FAR MORE detailed than that Messianic prophecy...

The Eastern Gate prophecy for instance...

In a nutshell, God said well over 2000 years ago in Ezekiel that when this gate found in Jerusalem is sealed that it will remain sealed until the messiah returns and walks through it. It was sealed in 1517 and it still remains sealed today after almost 500 years and after serveral attempts to falsify the prophecy.

Interestingly enough, in Ezekiel it states that the messiah would not walk though the original gate but a porch of the gate which was an addition to the orginal. How could Ezekiel even know about such an addition hundreds of years before it was built? On top that, how would he have know that it would be sealed and when the gate was sealed, it would remained closed until the messiah reveals himself and is exalted. Furthermore, the fulfillment was not brought about by those who believed the prophecy but those who did not believe the Bible.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

so , you just throw a quick responce to the jesus wasn't the messiah and come back with marie was the offspring??? so, since we're making statements without proof on that one, i am going to go as far as comparing biblical prophets to nostradamus (spelling?)...you make enough prophecies some will come true...and some people will read what they want into them

[campbell34]

it seems like this...what has been prophecied that WITHOUT doubt can be considered true? like that jesus would be an offspring of david? then why is it that in matthew 1:12 and luke 3 it shows that actually joseph is the offspring of david, not jesus...so that could mean two things then, huh? either jesus is merelly a man, or not the messiah...
It does not say that Jesus will be the offspring of David, it states He will come from the line of David.

[campbell34]

so , you just throw a quick responce to the jesus wasn't the messiah and come back with marie was the offspring??? so, since we're making statements without proof on that one, i am going to go as far as comparing biblical prophets to nostradamus (spelling?)...you make enough prophecies some will come true...and some people will read what they want into themThe prophecies of the Bible are all true. That's what makes the Bible special. The Bible even tells you why at the time of the end, God allows the Jews to return to Israel, and it also tells you what is going to happen here in America.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

The prophecies of the Bible are all true. That's what makes the Bible special. Is this just what you beleive or do you have actual proof that the prophecies are all true?? I can say "hmmmm there will be a great flood, and sometime in the existence of the world there will be one, doesnt mean I was right.

[JesusDiedForU]

Is this just what you beleive or do you have actual proof that the prophecies are all true?? I can say "hmmmm there will be a great flood, and sometime in the existence of the world there will be one, doesnt mean I was right.



Find a prophecy (to this date) that has not been fulfilled... That is what makes the Bible so unique it is a flawless book even all its prophecies remain flawless and can be trusted-past,present and future. The Bible is trully the words of God. The Bible's accruacy demonstrates it.

[campbell34]

Is this just what you beleive or do you have actual proof that the prophecies are all true?? I can say "hmmmm there will be a great flood, and sometime in the existence of the world there will be one, doesnt mean I was right.




A careful study of the prophecies will reveal that these prophecies are true. Saying there will be a great flood is kind of a general statement. The Bible is far more detailed then that. The Bible states that at the time of the end the Jews will return to the land of Israel. They will take Southern Israel first, and they will take Jerusalem second. (Southern Israel taken 1948, Jerusalem taken 1967.) The Bible states that at this time Jerusalems Old East Gate will have a porch built onto it, and the porch of the Old Gate will be sealed up, and will remain sealed until the Prince to come will open it. ( Porch of the East Gate was sealed up around 500 years ago) The Bible states all attempts to open the Gate will fail. (Two attempts to open the Gate by Moslems to break the prophecy. Once in 1916, and second time in 1967, both attempts failed.) These prophecies are detailed, and every part of this prophecy is true. The prophecies also speak of events that will take place in the Middle East, Russia, Europe, and America. Most Christians hear little about these prophecies, because the church is asleep. The Bible states that God will allow the Jews to return to Israel, yet they will be surrounded by enemies. The Bible states that Russia will finally put together a coalition to push the Jews out of their land. America will not lift a finger nor will anyone else to stop this great army. When the Jews backs are against the wall, and there is no hope of stopping their destruction. God will appear and destroy this Great army. At this time, the Jewish people will see that the one who has saved them and their nation is Jesus Christ. You can read about this in the Old Testament, Ezekiel, chapters 37,38,and 39, also Zec. chapter 12. There is much more to the prophecies, but that is a start if you are intrested.

[outlaw immortal]

wow.......i'm impressed! everyone knows so much about religion in general. ::slaps self after noticing this is a religion forum::


either way, i gotta agree with FunkyPhreshMama on this one.

[JesusDiedForU]

wow.......i'm impressed! everyone knows so much about religion in general. ::slaps self after noticing this is a religion forum::


either way, i gotta agree with FunkyPhreshMama on this one.
And yet you probably have no idea on what we just said... never even heard of such prophecies... Don't worry most of the world hasn't

[BlackBillBlake]

Better off not knowing. Babylon is actually in Iraq, and is currently occupied by US forces, who have done permanant damage to an extremely important archaelological site.

The only other realistic candidiate for Babylon is Sheffield, Lancashire.

[SvgGrdnBeauty]

Babylon is actually in Iraq, and is currently occupied by US forces, who have done permanant damage to an extremely important archaelological site.




Yes they have...how destroyed the archaeological record has become...and how ruined our oldest material remains...pillaged and plundered and sold off on the black market...and theives are digging and ruining the statigraphy of these sites so that we may not see the layers of preservation...and its just really horrible...one of my professors has been working with the Bagdad museum to try and recover some of these things...but its hard...and so the Iraqi people are losing important parts of their cultural heritage as well as the human family is...for Babylon and Sumaria are incredibly important as they were the first locations of cities and writing in antiquity. So, all are to blame for the destruction of these precious Mesopotamian sites...and now we must stop it before we lose a whole ancient culture...

[JesusDiedForU]

Better off not knowing. Babylon is actually in Iraq, and is currently occupied by US forces, who have done permanant damage to an extremely important archaelological site.

The only other realistic candidiate for Babylon is Sheffield, Lancashire.The Babylon spoke of in the Bible is considered a dominate country and is the world's policeman. Many people thought and still do think that Babylon, Iraq--a city--was the prophetic Babylon but keep in mind what flag is flying over Iraq today. YES, AMERICA is the world's policeman and she will fall.

[BlackBillBlake]

The Babylon spoke of in the Bible is considered a dominate country and is the world's policeman. Many people thought and still do think that Babylon, Iraq--a city--was the prophetic Babylon but keep in mind what flag is flying over Iraq today. YES, AMERICA is the world's policeman and she will fall.
America is the world's 'policeman' only for some time. Very likely, China will overtake the US in the next few years.
There's no reason whatever to imagine America is Babylon. Other than wishful thinking.

[JesusDiedForU]

America is the world's 'policeman' only for some time. Very likely, China will overtake the US in the next few years.
There's no reason whatever to imagine America is Babylon. Other than wishful thinking.
The inspired words of the Bible declare that America is Babylon based on the descriptions. It is the only country that can fit into all the descriptions.

Here are just a hand-full of many prophecies that point to America being Babylon.

Babylon dwells on many waters, and has abundant treasures. (Jeremiah 51:13)

-(Jeremiah 51:13) Babylon dwells on many waters. This could not be a reference to ancient Babylon because the city was built in the desert. America has the Atlantic Ocean to the east, the Pacific Ocean to the west, the Great Lakes to the north, the Gulf of Mexico to the south, the Missouri and the Mississippi Rivers run through the center of the nation, and Alaska borders the Beauport Sea. Yes, America dwells on many waters.

Babylon's cities will be destroyed. (Jeremiah 51:43)

-(Jeremiah 51:43) Some say that Babylon is just a city. If that is true, why does the Bible say that the cities of Babylon will be destroyed? Can a city have cities? Or does a nation have cities? America has many cities. In the Old Testament, God spoke of Israel as a city. Yet, Israel was a nation.

Babylon is a land filled with people from other lands and is a land of mingled people. (Jeremiah 50:16) (Jeremiah 50:37 )

-(Jeremiah 50:16 & 37) Babylon is a place filled with people from other lands, and is a land of mingled people. America's population is made up of mingled people and people from other lands. America has always been described as the great melting pot because of its ethnic diversity.

When Babylon is destroyed, her great voice will be silenced. (Jeremiah 51:55)

- (Jeremiah 51:55) When Babylon speaks, it is with a great voice. America is the nation that speaks with a great voice in the world today. America champions freedom and democracy for all the nations of the world, and it will be America's great voice that will be silenced.

God addresses the Jews living in Babylon. (Jeremiah 51:45 to 50) (Revelation 18:4)

-(Jeremiah 51: 45-50) (Revelation 18:4) Since God addresses the Jews living in Babylon, there must be a substantial number of Jews living there. Outside of Israel, the greatest number of Jews in the world today live in America; 5.2 million at the time of this writing.

The merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. (Revelation 18:3)

-(Revelation 18:3) Babylon made the merchants of the earth wealthy because of the abundances of her delicacies. America conducts more trade with the world than any nation on earth. America became wealthy from trade and made other nations wealthy.

Babylon glorifies herself. (Revelation 18:7)

-(Revelation 18:7) Babylon glorifies herself. In all of history, I cannot think of one nation that has glorified herself more than the United States. Americans are proud of their wealth, of their accomplishments, of their military power. Yes, America glorifies itself with flags, bumper stickers, parades, music, movies, and yearly celebrations.

Babylon is described as a country. (Isaiah 13:5)

-(Isaiah 13:5) Babylon is described as a country and not a city.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

Hey Jesus, I am wondering your own personal opinion on all of the issues we discussed in here, but I am seeing a lot of cut and paste.

[Sri Baba]

http://www.apostatesofislam.com

http://www.faithfreedom.org

http://www.apostatesofislam.com/forum/index.php

http://www.faithfreedom.org/forum/index.php

http://www.faithfreedom.org/holiday/phpBB2/index.php


According to these links the Quran has been changed over time.

http://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-myths-koran-manuscripts.htm

http://www.al-islam.org/encyclopedia/chapter8/3.html

http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Text/

http://www.jodkowski.pl/re/MBright.html

http://cremesti.com/amalid/Islam/Yemeni_Ancient_Koranic_Texts.htm



http://imrepublican.topcities.com/Islam/islam.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2829059.stm

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

http://atheism.about.com/cs/islamandviolence/

http://www.twin-towers.net/al-farooq_photos.htm

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/asiapcf/southeast/08/17/martyr.culture/index.html

http://muslim-quotes.netfirms.com/jihad.html

http://www.domini.org/openbook/home.htm

http://www.persecution.org

http://frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=9583

http://www.danielpipes.org/

http://www.angelfire.com/hi5/kafirdomunity/action.htm

http://www.geocities.com/khola_mon/BTaliban/Bangla_Taliban_Photos.html

http://www.bwoi.cjb.net

http://www.chechentruth.cjb.net/

http://www.anti-cair-net.org/

http://www.arabsforisrael.com/pages/1/index.htm

http://www.rotter.net/israel/

http://www.geocities.com/the_awful_truth_about_islam/index.htm

http://www.geocities.com/khola_mon/Islam.html

http://www.atcoalition.net/

http://www.taliban-online.info/

http://www.geocities.com/milkmandan2003/TalibanOnline1.html

http://www.truthtree.com/Debating/posts/755.html

http://kafirnation.com/portal/index.asp

http://www.isralert.com/archives/2005/03/deceit_thy_name.php

http://protesting-islam.com/

http://www.factsandlogic.org




"Modern Liberals, With Some Exceptions, Are Fascists. They Preach Peace At The Expense Of Liberty, Diversity At The Expense Of Common Sense, Equality At The Expense Of Fairness And Choice At The Expense Of Life. They Are The First To Speak About Rights, Yet They Seek To Deny You Yours If You Disagree With Them. They Vociferate The Importance Of Free Speech, Yet Do Everything In Their Power To Stifle Yours. They Demonize The Very System Which Allows Them The Freedom To Criticize In The First Place, And They Are The Last People In Line When It Comes To Defending The One Country On Earth That Would Ever Tolerate Their Hypocrisy. They Are Divisive, Immoral And Utterly Incapable Of Understanding Why Everything I Just Wrote Is The Truth." - Edward L. Daley


http://massgraves.info/

[Sri Baba]

Babylon is in Iraq and will never be anywhere else. The USA was never Babylon and will never be Babylon.

[Sri Baba]

THEOSOPHY, Vol. 43, No. 11, September, 1955
(Pages 511-518; Size: 21K)
THE ANATHEMAS AGAINST ORIGEN

I

[Part 1 of a 5-part series]

Men and parties, sects and schools are but the mere ephemera of the world's day. TRUTH, high-seated upon its rock of adamant, is alone eternal and supreme.

--Isis Unveiled
NOT one in a million perhaps of all those who call themselves "Christian" has the faintest conception of the history surrounding the early beginnings of his Church. Almost everyone is familiar with what is recorded in the New Testament concerning the differences of opinion that arose between Peter and Paul. But how many are aware of the fact that the cleavage here commenced, continued to grow; that for several centuries after the time of Jesus the best and most prominent of the Church Fathers were irreconcilably divided among themselves on issues of basic doctrine? How many even know that in order to retain power and authority, the dominant sectarians inaugurated a custom never before known in the recorded annals of religious history -- the custom of anathema? These men were too narrow and dogmatic in belief to allow room within the Church for natural divergencies of opinion, which alone could have made of Christianity a vital and healthy organism, and the result was a course of action diametrically opposed to the principle of tolerance reflected in the life of their supposed inspiration, Jesus of Nazareth. Having no faith in their capacity to win the adherence of thinking minds, the Church Fathers used anathema for the purpose of "persuading" those who could not be converted, and of silencing those not to be persuaded.
A central philosophical figure of this particular phase of Church History, the individual who contributed more perhaps than any other person to the true health and vigor of the living Church, was Origen -- philosopher, scientist, saint. Through the study of comparative religions, and especially with the help of Greek and Oriental inspiration, Origen sought to establish Christianity on a philosophic basis by showing the fundamental ideas beneath them all to be the same. According to Jerome, who adopted the words of Didymus, the blind theologian of Alexandria, Origen was "the greatest teacher of the Church after the apostles." This, of course, was before Jerome's enthusiasm for the teacher had cooled. The Encyclopædia Britannica says that Origen was "the most prominent of all the Church Fathers with the possible exception of Augustine." However this may be, the Church denounced Origen, and chose to follow the leadership of lesser lights. This decision began a series of anathemas, curses, and excommunications that drove from its membership the best and most elevated minds of the time.

Although Origen lived in the early part of the third century A.D., and although the anathema had been in use since about that time, it is to the sixth century especially, to an event that occurred in the year 543, that the student is invited to give all his attention. For the millennium "beginning with Buddha and Pythagoras at one end and the Neo-Platonists and Gnostics at the other, is the only focus left in History," says The Secret Doctrine, "wherein converge for the last time the bright rays of light streaming from the æons of time gone by, unobscured by the hand of bigotry and fanaticism."

The Fifth Ecumenical Council of the Christian Church was held in Constantinople in 553 A.D., and this date is sometimes taken by students of the ancient wisdom religions as marking the end of the "millennium of light" referred to by H.P.B. The Britannica, moreover, states that it was at this council that the Church pronounced the notorious "anathemas" against Origen, condemning as heretics all those who believe in and support his "impious" doctrines. The eminent Church historian, Robertson, however (according to Eirenicon for February-March, 1944), says that the anathemas were declared at an earlier local synod of Constantinople in 443. In any event, the Emperor Justinian, following the example of the Church, himself proclaimed a series of anathemas employing the following "Christian" sentiments:

If anyone does not anathematize Arius, Eunomius, Macedonius, Apollinaris, Nestorius, Eutyches and Origen, as well as their impious writings, as also all other heretics already condemned and anathematized by the Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, and by the aforesaid four Holy Synods and (if anyone does not equally anathematize) all those who have held and hold or who in their impiety persist in holding to the end the same opinion as those heretics just mentioned: let him be anathema.

(The Fifth Ecumenical Council)

Anathema to Origen and to that Adamantius, who set forth these opinions together with their nefarious and execrable and wicked doctrine, and to whomsoever there is who thinks thus, or defends these opinions, or in any way hereafter at any time shall presume to protect them.

(Emperor Justinian of Rome)
Whether the thousand years of darkness that hung over Europe was due to some force antagonistic to the Church, as is claimed by some religious historians, or to these very acts of the Church itself, is a question no one can decide for another, but which every sincere Christian ought to think about and attempt to answer for himself. Those who believe in "Karma, the universal Law of Justice," are able to detect in this scene what appears a perfect example of the operation of moral cause and effect: by refusing to allow sincere divergencies of opinion inside the Church, Christianity, as a result, found itself split, a thousand years later, into a multitude of sects without!
One phase of the work of the Theosophical Movement of the present age is the vindication of glorious but calumniated reputations. In Isis Unveiled and The Secret Doctrine, H. P. Blavatsky spared no effort to call the attention of thinking mankind to the abuses and slander, the tragic injustices perpetrated by the ruling faction of the early Church against its many opponents, among them being Origen. Vindication of the life and work of Origen, defender of the true spirit of Christianity, is long overdue; and this can best be achieved by declaring the true nature and character of Origen's teachings. Unfortunately, little remains of the writings; the works of Origen, with few exceptions, were destroyed. Yet the irony of this particular page of Church history is the astonishing fact that, by pronouncing its curses, the Church actually helped to preserve some of the teachings it intended to destroy.

It is proposed therefore to list the anathemas just as they stand, leaving each individual student to search out for himself the shreds of truth that remain. (In a forthcoming issue, effort will be made to suggest the similarities of doctrine, as here portrayed, between the system of Origen and that of the ancient Wisdom-Religion, or Theosophy. As is so often the case, the doctrines contrary to those of Origen -- in this instance the anathemas -- help to clarify Theo-sophia by contrast. Obviously, though, in such condensed treatment, the writer hopes merely to be provocative.)

THE ANATHEMAS AGAINST ORIGEN(1)
The Fifth Ecumenical Council
The Second Council of Constantinople
A.D. 553

I

If anyone assert the fabulous pre-existence of souls, and shall assert the monstrous restoration which follows from it: let him be anathema.

II

If anyone shall say that the creation of all reasonable things includes only intelligences without bodies and altogether immaterial, having neither number or name, so that there is unity between them all by identity of substance, force and energy, and by their union with and knowledge of God, the Word; but that no longer desiring the sight of God, they gave themselves over to worse things, each one following his own inclinations, and that they have taken bodies more or less subtile, and have received names, for among the heavenly Powers there is a difference of names as there is also a difference of bodies; and thence some became and are called Cherubims, others Seraphims, and Principalities, and Powers, and Dominations, and Thrones, and Angels, and as many other heavenly orders as there may be: let him be anathema.

III

If anyone shall say that the sun, the moon, and the stars are also reasonable things, and that they have only become what they are because they turned towards evil: let him be anathema.

IV

If anyone shall say that the reasonable creatures in whom the divine love had grown cold have been hidden in gross bodies such as ours, and have been called men, while those who have attained the lowest degree of wickedness have shared cold and obscure bodies and are become and called demons and evil spirits: let him be anathema.

V

If anyone shall say that a psychic condition has come from an angelic or archangelic state, and moreover that a demoniac and a human condition has come from a psychic condition, and that from a human state they may become again angels and demons, and that each order of heavenly virtues is either all from those below or from those above and below: let him be anathema.

VI

If anyone shall say that there is a twofold race of demons, of which the one includes the souls of men and the other the superior spirits who fell to this, and that of all the number of reasonable beings there is but one which has remained unshaken in the love and contemplation of God, and that that spirit is become Christ and the king of all reasonable beings, and that he has created all the bodies which exist in heaven, on earth, and between heaven and earth; and that the world which has in itself elements more ancient than itself, and which exist by themselves, viz: dryness, damp, heat and cold, and the image to which it was formed, was so formed, and that the most holy and consubstantial Trinity did not create the world, but that it was created by the working intelligence which is more ancient than the world, and which communicates to it its being: let him be anathema.

VII

If anyone shall say that Christ, of whom it is said that he appeared in the form of God, and that he was united before all time with God the Word, and humbled himself in those last days even to humanity, had (according to their expression) pity upon the divers falls which had appeared in the spirits united in the same unity (of which he himself is part), and that to restore them he passed through divers classes, had different bodies and different names, became all to all, an Angel among Angels, a Power among Powers, had clothed himself in the different classes of reasonable beings with a form corresponding to that class, and finally has taken flesh and blood like ours and is become man for man; [if anyone says all this] and does not profess that God the Word humbled himself and became man: let him be anathema.

VIII

If anyone shall not acknowledge that God the Word, of the same substance with the Father and the Holy Ghost, and who was made flesh and became man, one of the Trinity, is Christ in every sense of the word, but [shall affirm] that he is so only in an inaccurate manner, and because of the abasement, as they call it, of the intelligence; if anyone shall affirm that this intelligence united to God the Word, is the Christ in the true sense of the word, while the Logos is only called Christ because of this union with the intelligence, and e converso that the intelligence is only called God because of the Logos: let him be anathema.

IX

If anyone shall say that it was not the Divine Logos made man by taking an animated body with a rational spirit (anima rationalis) and VOEPA, that he descended into hell and ascended into heaven, but shall pretend that it is the NOUS which has done this, that NOUS of which they say (in an impious fashion) he is Christ, properly called, and that he is become so by knowledge of the Monad: let him be anathema.

X

If anyone shall say that after the resurrection the body of the Lord was ethereal, having the form of a sphere, and that such shall be the bodies of all after the resurrection; and that after the Lord himself shall have rejected his true body and after the others who rise shall have rejected theirs, the nature of their bodies shall be annihilated: let him be anathema.

XI

If anyone shall say that the future judgment signifies the destruction of the body and that the end of the story will be an immaterial [false appearance?] and that thereafter there will no longer be any matter, but only spirit: let him be anathema.

XII

If anyone shall say that the heavenly Powers and all men and the Devil and evil spirits are united with the Word of God in all respects, as the NOUS which is by them called Christ and which is in the form of God, and which humbled itself as they say; and [if anyone shall say] that the kingdom of Christ shall have an end: let him be anathema.

XIII

If anyone shall say that Christ [i.e., the NOUS] is in no wise different from other reasonable beings, neither substantially nor by wisdom nor by his power and might over all things but that all will be placed at the right hand of God, as well as he that is called by them Christ [the NOUS], as also they were in the feigned pre-existence of all things: let him be anathema.

XIV

If anyone shall say that all reasonable beings will one day be united in one, when the hypostases as well as the numbers and the bodies shall have disappeared, and that the knowledge of the world to come will carry with it the ruin of worlds, and the rejection of bodies as also the abolition of [all] names, and that there shall be finally an identity ... of the hypostasis; moreover, that in this pretended apocatastasis, spirits only will continue to exist, as it was in the feigned pre-existence; let him be anathema.

XV

If anyone shall say that the life of the spirits shall be like to the life which was in the beginning while as yet the spirits had not come down or fallen, so that the end and the beginning shall be alike, and that the end shall be the true measure of the beginning; let him be anathema.

THE ANATHEMATISMS OF THE EMPEROR JUSTINIAN
AGAINST ORIGEN
Constantinople, A.D. 553

I

Whoever says or thinks that human souls pre-existed, i.e., that they had previously been spirits and holy powers, but that, satiated with the vision of God, they had turned to evil, and in this way the divine love in them had died out and they had therefore become souls and had been condemned to punishment in bodies, shall be anathema.

II

If anyone says or thinks that the soul of the Lord pre-existed and was united with God the Word before the Incarnation and Conception of the Virgin, let him be anathema.

III

If anyone says or thinks that the body of our Lord Jesus Christ was first formed in the womb of the holy Virgin and that afterwards there was united with it God the Word and the pre-existing soul, let him be anathema.

IV

If anyone says or thinks that the word of God has become like to all heavenly orders, so that for the cherubim he was a cherub, for the seraphim a seraph: in short, like all the superior powers, let him be anathema.

V

If anyone says or thinks that at the resurrection, human bodies will rise spherical in form and unlike our present form, let him be anathema.

VI

If anyone says that the heavens, the sun, the moon, the stars, and the waters that are above heavens, have souls, and are reasonable beings, let him be anathema.

VII

If anyone says or thinks that Christ the Lord in a future time will be crucified for demons, as he was for man, let him be anathema.

VIII

If anyone says or thinks that the power of God is limited, and that he created as much as he was able to compass, let him be anathema.

IX

If anyone says or thinks that the punishment of demons and of impious men is only temporary, and will one day have an end, and that a restoration will take place of demons and of impious men, let him be anathema.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
COMPILER'S NOTE: The following is a separate item which followed the above article but was on the same page. I felt it was useful to include it here:
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RATIONALIZATION OF UNTRUTH

What devout religious believer would not lie about some enemy of his religion, if by so doing he might prevent an attack on his faith or because it might possibly benefit by an untruth? The religious believer's conscience would not be "clear" if he did not resort to every devious means to defend his religion.

In 1378, when the infamous Urban VI became Pope, he, as head of the Roman Catholic Church, "made a solemn and general declaration against keeping faith with heretics." How convenient to resort to false reasoning and Jesuitical sophistry to support an untenable premise!

Martin Luther, after admonishing Philip of Hesse to tell a "good stout lie," defends his advice in the following words: "What would it matter if, for the sake of the Christian Church, one were to tell a big lie?"

Macaulay, in evaluating the doctrine, said that "pagans, who had never heard the name of Christ, and who were guided only by the highest light of nature, were more trustworthy members of civil society than men who had been formed from schools of the Popish casuists."



http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/TheAnathemasAgainstOrigenSeries/Part1of5.html

[Sri Baba]

The Bible is a complete fabrication. It has been rewritten a million times by con artists who try to rob and enslave you.

[Sri Baba]

http://associate.com/library/The_Reading_Room/False_Teaching_n_Teachers_2/No_Maam_Thats_Not_History_.shtml

[JesusDiedForU]

Hey Jesus, I am wondering your own personal opinion on all of the issues we discussed in here, but I am seeing a lot of cut and paste.
It is exactly what I would have written... And on top of that those are my father's words that i copied

[JesusDiedForU]

Babylon is in Iraq and will never be anywhere else. The USA was never Babylon and will never be Babylon.
(FROM A PAPER I WROTE)

A more recent theory that has arisen in the past few decades is that the Babylon that is talked about in Jeremiah 50 and 51 and Revelation 18 is describing the ancient archaeological site in Iraq. Coombes says the main reason scholars believe this theory is because they take the passages describing Babylon literally and figure that the

Babylon that once was is the Babylon that will become a great city. Similar to Rome, theologians believe that Babylon will again be rebuilt and become a world power. In his book The Rise of Babylon Charles H. Dyer believed with Saddam Hussein spending millions of dollars in restoring the ancient city of Babylon, that Babylon, Iraq was the true Babylon.

However, yet again, the prophecies do not match up. Ancient Babylon is described differently than future Babylon. For instance, Logsdon describes in Jeremiah 50:37 that Babylon is mentioned as the land of mingled people. There may be a few nations that could fit this but Babylon, Iraq is not one of them. Reference-guides.com says that the entire country of Iraq has only about five ethnic groups and of those five 80% is Arab. Also, in his book Your Future: An A-Z Index to Prophecy Jack Van Impe states Babylon is described as the land of many waters as described in Jeremiah 51:13. However, www.reference-guides.com (http://www.reference-guides.com/) declares that Iraq is mainly a desert.

Furthermore, Coombes says Babylon is described as a major trader in the world and is so much of an importance that when she is destroyed merchants will be asking, “Who will buy our goods?” But will the merchants of the earth be crying over Iraq, more specifically Babylon, Iraq, when all Iraq imports is food, medicine, and manufactures. On top of this, if only one city on this earth was gone would there be no one else to trade with? In addition, the same reasons Rome is not Babylon, can also be included in why Iraq is not Babylon. Babylon is a country not a city, and it is described as the youngest country. Those descriptions are simply not the descriptions of Babylon, Iraq.

The most powerful evidence that proves that Iraq is not the Babylon has happened in recent events in Iraq. R.A. Coombes tells that in Jeremiah 50:23 Babylon is described as the “Hammer of the whole earth” . Coombes says that America has been portrayed as the world’s policeman . Look at what flag is flying over Iraq today. Saddam Hussein is out of power. Who is now in control of the country of Iraq? The country that is in control of old Babylon is where one will find the true Babylon.

As a result, ancient Babylon theorists base the identity of future Babylon off ancient Babylon and overlook the prophecies that describe it. They take the literal view and exclude the view that Babylon may be symbolic. Overall, the descriptions neglect the literal Babylon.

[JesusDiedForU]

The Bible is a complete fabrication. It has been rewritten a million times by con artists who try to rob and enslave you.
The Bible states that it was inspired by God (2 Timothy 3:16). However, I believe the Bible was inspired by God not because the it says so, but because the prophecies of the Bible have never failed.

Predicting the future with a 100% accuracy is something that men cannot do. Only God knows the future with such detail. Although it has been translated, the Bible's meaning has never changed. Ancient scrolls demonstrate this. The DEAD SEA SCROLLS were untouched for thousands of years, and compared to the Bible we have today it still has the same meaning.

"There have been hundreds of books written on the subject of the evidences of the divine inspiration of the Bible, and these evidences are many and varied. Most people today, unfortunately, have not read any of these books. In fact, few have even read the Bible itself! Thus, many people tend to go along with the popular delusion that the Bible is full of mistakes and is no longer relevant to our modern world"

"It is common for people in our age to dismiss the Bible as "myth and ancient history." It is also politically correct to view Bible believers as closed-minded but the real closed-minded ones are those who neglect to check out for themselves what the Bible is really about" (Why I Believe the Bible, Scott Huckaby).

[FunkyPhreshMama]

It is exactly what I would have written... And on top of that those are my father's words that i copied
If you believe he bible exacly how it is written, then you are the first christian who does so...and do you rest on the seventh day of the week? apperently not, since your in the rasta forum trying to take over on religious thread by making it your own...We Are not talking about Babylon, the place...

[FunkyPhreshMama]

also, as far as all the prophecies that have come true...well, here

Matthew 1:23 says the mesiah's name would be Immanuel...never is he called that

Jesus mistakenly tells his followers that he will return and establish his kingdom within their lifetime

Amen, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation. (Matthew 23:36 )

How about that the end of times would come during jesus' followers lifetime????

Amen, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things have taken place. Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away. (Mark 13:30-31)

I could find more...but i already proved that not everything in the bible is true as for told...bible was written by men, and then called a scipture by men...and when asked for the source of the scripture...very convincingly IT CAME FROM GOD...in like 2000 years people are going to look are Stephen King's It as a holy book, and believe that clowns live in sewers and eat children...and then people will believe that Spehen King was a prophet of Pennywise, The Great Killer Clown God.

[JesusDiedForU]

If you believe he bible exacly how it is written, then you are the first christian who does so...and do you rest on the seventh day of the week? apperently not, since your in the rasta forum trying to take over on religious thread by making it your own...We Are not talking about Babylon, the place...
Christians believe that the Bible is a 100% true... because it was all of it was inspired by God.

Yes, I know there is some debate on when is the Sabbath day... is it Sunday or is it Saturday? Most Christians celebrate it on Sunday but is it correct maybe not. Perhaps it is like Christmas... Is that really the day that Christ was born--doubt it. However, it is the day that Christians celebrate His birth.

I live for Jesus 7 days a week. I believe when God says day of rest, he did not mean go to church, sit around the house, and read the Bible. I believe God rather ment we should talk off work and perhaps do the things we love. Now that varies from person to person. But I highly doubt He meant taking a break from telling others about Him.

According to the descriptions of the Bible there is only one country that can be Babylon and it goes by the name of AMERICA

[JesusDiedForU]

also, as far as all the prophecies that have come true...well, here

Matthew 1:23 says the mesiah's name would be Immanuel...never is he called that

Jesus mistakenly tells his followers that he will return and establish his kingdom within their lifetime

Amen, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation. (Matthew 23:36 )

How about that the end of times would come during jesus' followers lifetime????

Amen, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things have taken place. Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away. (Mark 13:30-31)

I could find more...but i already proved that not everything in the bible is true as for told...bible was written by men, and then called a scipture by men...and when asked for the source of the scripture...very convincingly IT CAME FROM GOD...in like 2000 years people are going to look are Stephen King's It as a holy book, and believe that clowns live in sewers and eat children...and then people will believe that Spehen King was a prophet of Pennywise, The Great Killer Clown God.
You did not prove anything. Just rehearsed common misconceptions of Bible prophecies. They are easily ansered but I do not have time now... I need to get sleep as I have an 8 AM class tomorrow : o

Don't worry I will provide the answers for you... I will try to show you that the Bible is the truth despite what the world has to say.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

are you not just a man? or d you consider yourself apointed to some higher position? you came into the forum of the religion Rastafari...and now trying to show everyone how right you are, and that everyone else is wrong...i believe that jesus himself had warned his followers of false prophets...you assume that everything you type is true to the dot, and that's it...if you go to the christanity forum, start a thread called "my closed minded ass thinks that the bible's babylon is actually the united states, not Bablyon the world power that existed nearly 3000 years ago" then maybe you will not have people attempting to argue with you...but until you post some of your own thoughts, not your dads, or heavenly father, or who ever else you quote, this conversation realy doesn't have much of a point anymore, does it?

[JesusDiedForU]

are you not just a man? or d you consider yourself apointed to some higher position? you came into the forum of the religion Rastafari...and now trying to show everyone how right you are, and that everyone else is wrong...i believe that jesus himself had warned his followers of false prophets...you assume that everything you type is true to the dot, and that's it...if you go to the christanity forum, start a thread called "my closed minded ass thinks that the bible's babylon is actually the united states, not Bablyon the world power that existed nearly 3000 years ago" then maybe you will not have people attempting to argue with you...but until you post some of your own thoughts, not your dads, or heavenly father, or who ever else you quote, this conversation realy doesn't have much of a point anymore, does it?
Yes I am just a man but I am living in the truth of grace. Are you saying that Jesus warned against false prophets that promote Jesus? Because that is what I am doing... promoting Jesus.

Basically, everyone I write comes of the Bible and that is true "to the dot."

Are you kidding me? People not argue with me in the Christian forum? Have you ever been in there? It is all Athiests and anti-Bible people. There are only a remnant of Christians. I posted part of a paper I wrote that descredited the theory that the literal Babylon in Iraq is the Babylon spoke about in Jeremiah 50 & 51 and Revelation 18. Babylon is a FUTURE, DOMINANT, WEALTHY COUNTRY that is why it is spoke of in the book of REVELATION...

[JesusDiedForU]

FunkyPhreshMama]also, as far as all the prophecies that have come true...well, here[/b]

Matthew 1:23 says the mesiah's name would be Immanuel...never is he called that[QUOTE]
To start, Immanuel means God with us... says that right in the Bible. The name is found in both Isaiah and Matthew. The verses are a messianic prophecy which in other words were spoken about by Isaiah in the OT about 700 years before Christ came to the earth and then when He came it was recorded and fulfilled in Matthew...

Isaiah 7:14 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=29&chapter=7&verse=14&version=31&context=verse)
Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.

ABOUT 700 years later...

Matthew 1:23 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=47&chapter=1&verse=23&version=31&context=verse)
"The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and they will call him Immanuel" —which means, "God with us."





Jesus mistakenly tells his followers that he will return and establish his kingdom within their lifetime

Amen, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation. (Matthew 23:36 )

-Let's read the verse in context...

Therefore I am sending you prophets and wise men and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town. 35And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36I tell you the truth, all this will come upon this generation.

Yeah, no where do you see that Christ says He will return...


How about that the end of times would come during jesus' followers lifetime????

Amen, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things have taken place. Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away. (Mark 13:30-31)
-What are all these things?! Perhaps the signs that Jesus spoke about through out the whole chapter of Mark 13 that you failed to mention. None of those signs had even come close to being fulfilled in the time of Christ's time, however whoever does see those signs, that generation will not pass away without the return of the Lord Jesus Christ....

[FunkyPhreshMama]

Isaiah 7:14
Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.

ABOUT 700 years later...

Matthew 1:23
"The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and they will call him Immanuel" —which means, "God with us."
once again, they say a child WILL be born called Immanuel, once Jesus was born, is there anything in the bible about him being called that???????

I really find it hard to beleive anything you say when all you do is cut and paste from the bible, if you wan't to argue for Christianity you have to be able to back yourself up without a bible in your hands....................

[JesusDiedForU]

once again, they say a child WILL be born called Immanuel, once Jesus was born, is there anything in the bible about him being called that???????

I really find it hard to beleive anything you say when all you do is cut and paste from the bible, if you wan't to argue for Christianity you have to be able to back yourself up without a bible in your hands....................
The Bible is my sword in which I use to go to battle with. It was inspired by God and useful for teaching, rebuting, and correcting.

Understand that Christians live life as if the Bible were a pair of class. Anything they do should be based on the Bible. Therefore if you want to try to discredit Christianity you must discredit the Bible by which we believe are the words of God giving to us for dirrection.

[JesusDiedForU]

vote pedro!!!!!!!


JD4U, get your pompous ass back to the christians thread where at least the people who have to read your garbage went there specifically for a laugh!!!

i mean it, or i'll unleash on you.
"Hit me with your best shot" ;)

[JesusDiedForU]

As for Immanuel...

Immanuel literally means "God is with us." This is a significant because Jesus is God in flesh:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God....and the Word became flesh and dwelt among us..." (John 1:1,14).

For in Him [Jesus] all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form" (Col. 2:9).


THEREFORE, we can see that a prophecy of Jesus being "Immanuel" is dealing with him being God, the word, in flesh. This was fulfilled in the birth of Jesus when the Word, known as the Son, second person of the Trinity, became flesh. We call this the incarnation.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

well, here we go, and I'm not even going to take credit for these, these were from a friends work

1) How many generations were there between Abraham to David? Matthew 1:17 lists fourteen generations. Matthew 1:2 lists thirteen generations.

2) Is Paul lying? In Acts 20:35 Paul told people "to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, 'It is more blessed to give than to receive.'" Since Jesus never made such a biblical statement, isn’t Paul guilty of deception?

3) When did the leper become not a leper? (Matthew 8:13 & 8:14) Jesus healed the leper before visiting the house. (Mark 1:29-30 & 1:40-42) Jesus healed the leper after visiting Simon Peter’s house.

4) Who approached Jesus? (Matthew 8:5-7) The Centurion approached Jesus, beseeching help for a sick servant. (Luke 7:3 & 7:6-7) The Centurion did not approach Jesus. He sent friends and elders of the Jews.

5) Was she dead or just dying? (Matthew 9:18) He asked for help, saying his daughter was already dead. (Luke 8:41-42) Jairus approached Jesus for help, because his daughter was dying.

6) Just what did Jesus instruct them to take? (Matthew 10:10) Jesus instructed them not to take a staff, not to wear sandals. (Mark 6:8-9) Jesus instructed his disciples to wear sandals and take a staff on their journey.

7) When did John find out Jesus was the Messiah? (Matthew 11:2-3) While imprisoned. John the Baptist sent followers to Jesus to inquire if Jesus was the messiah. (Luke 7:18-22) While imprisoned. John the Baptist sent followers to Jesus to inquire if Jesus was the Messiah. (John 1 :29-34,36) John already knew Jesus was the Messiah.

8) Who made the request? (Matthew 20:20-21) Their mother requested that James and John, Zebedee’s children, should sit beside Jesus in his Kingdom. (Mark 10:35-37) James and John, Zebedee’s children, requested that they should sit beside Jesus in his Kingdom.

9) What animals were brought to Jesus? (Matthew 21:2-7) two of the disciples brought Jesus an ass and a colt from the village of Bethphage. (Mark 11:2-7) They brought him only a colt.

10) When did the fig tree hear of its doom? (Matthew 21:17-19) Jesus cursed the fig tree after purging the temple. (Mark 11:14-15 & 20) He cursed it before the purging.

11) When did the fig tree keel? (Matthew 21:9) The fig tree withered immediately. and the disciples registered surprise then and there. (Mark 11:12-14 & 20) The morning after Jesus cursed the fig tree, the disciples noticed it had withered and expressed astonishment.

12) Was John the Baptist Elias? "This is Elias which was to come." Matthew 11:14 "And they asked him, what then? Art thou Elias? And he said I am not." John l:21

13) Who was the father of Joseph? Matthew 1:16 The father of Joseph was Jacob. Luke 3 :23 The father of Joseph was Heli. Christians shall try to LIE and tell you that one is the heritage of Mary and the other Joseph. This is utter bullshit, the Hebrew and Greek cultures NEVER regarded the bloodline of the mother. They were patriarchal societies which only concerned themselves with paternal lineage.

14) How many generations were there from the Babylon captivity to Christ? Matthew 1:17 Fourteen generations, Matthew 1:12-16 Thirteen generations.

15) Matthew 2:15, 19 & 21-23 The infant Christ was taken into Egypt. Luke 2:22 & 39 The infant Christ was NOT taken to Egypt.

16) Matthew 5:1-2 Christ preached his first sermon on the mount. Luke 6:17 & 20 Christ preached his first sermon in the plain.

17) John was in prison when Jesus went into Galilee. Mark 1:14 John was not in prison when Jesus went into Galilee. John 1:43 & 3:22-24

18) What was the nationality of the woman who besought Jesus? Matthew 15:22 "And behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, Have mercy on me, 0 Lord, thou son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil." Mark 7:26 "The woman was a Greek, a Syrophenician by nation, and she besought him that he would cast forth the devil out of her daughter."

19) How many blind men besought Jesus? Matthew 20:30 Two blind men. Luke 18:35-38 Only one blind man.

20) Where did the devil take Jesus first? (Matthew 4:5-8) The Devil took Jesus first to the parapet of the temple, then to a high place to view all the Kingdoms of the world. (Luke 4:5-9) The Devil took Jesus first to a high place to view the kingdoms, then to the parapet of the temple.

21) Can one pray in public? (Matthew 6:5-6) Jesus condemned public prayer. (1 Timothy 2:8) Paul encouraged public prayer.

22) If we decide to do good works, should those works be seen? Matthew 5:16 "Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works." 1 Peter 2:12 "Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that ... they may by your good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation." This contradicts: Matthew 6:1-4 "Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them…that thine alms may be in secret." Matthew 23:3-5 "Do not ye after their [Pharisees'] works ... all their works they do for to be seen of men."

23) Who did Jesus tell the Lord’s Prayer to? (Matthew 5:1, 6:9-13 & 7:28) Jesus delivered the Lord’s Prayer during the Sermon on the Mount before the multitudes. (Luke 11:1-4) He delivered it before the disciples alone, and not as part of the Sermon on the Mount.

24) When was Christ crucified? Mark 15:25 "And it was the third hour and they crucified him." John 19:14-15 "And it was the preparation of the Passover, and about the sixth hour; and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your king…Shall I crucify your king?" John 19:14-15.

25) The two thieves reviled Christ. (Matthew 27:44 & Mark 15:32) Only one of the thieves reviled Christ. Luke 23:39-40.

26) In 1 Corinthians 1:17 ("For Christ sent me [Paul] not to baptize but to preach the gospel") Paul said Jesus was wrong when he said in Matthew 28:19 "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them…" Clearly one of these people is wrong, either way, it’s a contradiction.

27) When did Satan enter Judas? Satan entered into Judas while at the supper. John 13:27 Satan entered Judas before the supper. Luke 23:3-4 & 7

28) How many women came to the sepulcher? John 20:1 Only one woman went, Mary Magdalene. Matthew 28:1 Mary Magdalene and the "other Mary" (Jesus’ mother) went.

29) Mark 16:2 It was sunrise when the two women went to the sepulcher. John 20:1 It was still dark (before sunrise) when Mary Magdalene went alone to the sepulcher.

30) There were two angels seen by the women at the sepulcher and they were standing up. Luke 24:4 There was only one angel seen and he was sitting down. Mark 28:2-5

31) How many angels were within the sepulcher? John 20:11-12 two, Mark 16:5 one.

32) The Holy Ghost bestowed at Pentecost. Acts 1:5-8 & 2:1-4 The holy Ghost bestowed before Pentecost. John 20:22

33) Where did Jesus first appear to the eleven disciples? In a room in Jerusalem. Luke 24:32-37 On a mountain in Galilee. Matthew 28:15-17

34) Where did Christ ascend from? From Mount Olivet. Acts 1:9-12 From Bethany. Luke 24:50-51

35) Can all sins be forgiven? (Acts 13:39) All sins can be forgiven. Great, I’m happy to know God is so merciful, but wait (Mark 3:29) Cursing or blaspheming the Holy Spirit is unforgivable.

36) The Elijah mystery: (Malachi 4:5) Elijah must return before the final days of the world. (Matthew 11:12-14) Jesus said that John the Baptist was Elijah. (Matthew 17:12- 13) Jesus insists that Elijah has already come, and everyone understood him to mean John the Baptist. (Mark 9:13) Jesus insists that Elijah has already come. (John 1:21) John the Baptist maintained that he was not Elijah.

37) Who purchased the potter’s field? Acts 1:18 The field was purchased by Judas. John 20:1 The potter’s field was purchased by the chief priests.

38) Paul’s attendants heard the miraculous voice and stood speechless. Acts 9:7 Paul’s attendants did not hear the voice and were prostrate. Acts 22:9 & 26:14

39) Who bought the Sepulcher? Jacob, Josh 24:32 Abraham, Acts 7:16

40) Was it lawful for the Jews to put Christ to death? "The Jews answered him, we have a law, and by our law he ought to die." John 19:7 "The Jews therefore said unto him, It is not lawful for us to put any man to death." John 18:31

41) Has anyone ascended up to heaven? Elijah went up to heaven: "And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven." 2 Kings 2:11 "No man hath ascended up to heaven but he that came down from heaven, even the son of man." John 3:13

42) Is scripture inspired by God? "all scripture is given by inspiration of God." 2 Timothy 3:16 compared to: "But I speak this by permission and not by commandment." 1 Corinthians 7:6 "But to the rest speak I, not the Lord." 1 Corinthians 7:12 "That which I speak, I speak it not after the Lord" 2 Corinthians.

[campbell34]

well, here we go, and I'm not even going to take credit for these, these were from a friends work

1) How many generations were there between Abraham to David? Matthew 1:17 lists fourteen generations. Matthew 1:2 lists thirteen generations.

2) Is Paul lying? In Acts 20:35 Paul told people "to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, 'It is more blessed to give than to receive.'" Since Jesus never made such a biblical statement, isn’t Paul guilty of deception?

3) When did the leper become not a leper? (Matthew 8:13 & 8:14) Jesus healed the leper before visiting the house. (Mark 1:29-30 & 1:40-42) Jesus healed the leper after visiting Simon Peter’s house.

4) Who approached Jesus? (Matthew 8:5-7) The Centurion approached Jesus, beseeching help for a sick servant. (Luke 7:3 & 7:6-7) The Centurion did not approach Jesus. He sent friends and elders of the Jews.

5) Was she dead or just dying? (Matthew 9:18) He asked for help, saying his daughter was already dead. (Luke 8:41-42) Jairus approached Jesus for help, because his daughter was dying.

6) Just what did Jesus instruct them to take? (Matthew 10:10) Jesus instructed them not to take a staff, not to wear sandals. (Mark 6:8-9) Jesus instructed his disciples to wear sandals and take a staff on their journey.

7) When did John find out Jesus was the Messiah? (Matthew 11:2-3) While imprisoned. John the Baptist sent followers to Jesus to inquire if Jesus was the messiah. (Luke 7:18-22) While imprisoned. John the Baptist sent followers to Jesus to inquire if Jesus was the Messiah. (John 1 :29-34,36) John already knew Jesus was the Messiah.

8) Who made the request? (Matthew 20:20-21) Their mother requested that James and John, Zebedee’s children, should sit beside Jesus in his Kingdom. (Mark 10:35-37) James and John, Zebedee’s children, requested that they should sit beside Jesus in his Kingdom.

9) What animals were brought to Jesus? (Matthew 21:2-7) two of the disciples brought Jesus an ass and a colt from the village of Bethphage. (Mark 11:2-7) They brought him only a colt.

10) When did the fig tree hear of its doom? (Matthew 21:17-19) Jesus cursed the fig tree after purging the temple. (Mark 11:14-15 & 20) He cursed it before the purging.

11) When did the fig tree keel? (Matthew 21:9) The fig tree withered immediately. and the disciples registered surprise then and there. (Mark 11:12-14 & 20) The morning after Jesus cursed the fig tree, the disciples noticed it had withered and expressed astonishment.

12) Was John the Baptist Elias? "This is Elias which was to come." Matthew 11:14 "And they asked him, what then? Art thou Elias? And he said I am not." John l:21

13) Who was the father of Joseph? Matthew 1:16 The father of Joseph was Jacob. Luke 3 :23 The father of Joseph was Heli. Christians shall try to LIE and tell you that one is the heritage of Mary and the other Joseph. This is utter bullshit, the Hebrew and Greek cultures NEVER regarded the bloodline of the mother. They were patriarchal societies which only concerned themselves with paternal lineage.

14) How many generations were there from the Babylon captivity to Christ? Matthew 1:17 Fourteen generations, Matthew 1:12-16 Thirteen generations.

15) Matthew 2:15, 19 & 21-23 The infant Christ was taken into Egypt. Luke 2:22 & 39 The infant Christ was NOT taken to Egypt.

16) Matthew 5:1-2 Christ preached his first sermon on the mount. Luke 6:17 & 20 Christ preached his first sermon in the plain.

17) John was in prison when Jesus went into Galilee. Mark 1:14 John was not in prison when Jesus went into Galilee. John 1:43 & 3:22-24

18) What was the nationality of the woman who besought Jesus? Matthew 15:22 "And behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, Have mercy on me, 0 Lord, thou son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil." Mark 7:26 "The woman was a Greek, a Syrophenician by nation, and she besought him that he would cast forth the devil out of her daughter."

19) How many blind men besought Jesus? Matthew 20:30 Two blind men. Luke 18:35-38 Only one blind man.

20) Where did the devil take Jesus first? (Matthew 4:5-8) The Devil took Jesus first to the parapet of the temple, then to a high place to view all the Kingdoms of the world. (Luke 4:5-9) The Devil took Jesus first to a high place to view the kingdoms, then to the parapet of the temple.

21) Can one pray in public? (Matthew 6:5-6) Jesus condemned public prayer. (1 Timothy 2:8) Paul encouraged public prayer.

22) If we decide to do good works, should those works be seen? Matthew 5:16 "Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works." 1 Peter 2:12 "Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that ... they may by your good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation." This contradicts: Matthew 6:1-4 "Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them…that thine alms may be in secret." Matthew 23:3-5 "Do not ye after their [Pharisees'] works ... all their works they do for to be seen of men."

23) Who did Jesus tell the Lord’s Prayer to? (Matthew 5:1, 6:9-13 & 7:28) Jesus delivered the Lord’s Prayer during the Sermon on the Mount before the multitudes. (Luke 11:1-4) He delivered it before the disciples alone, and not as part of the Sermon on the Mount.

24) When was Christ crucified? Mark 15:25 "And it was the third hour and they crucified him." John 19:14-15 "And it was the preparation of the Passover, and about the sixth hour; and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your king…Shall I crucify your king?" John 19:14-15.

25) The two thieves reviled Christ. (Matthew 27:44 & Mark 15:32) Only one of the thieves reviled Christ. Luke 23:39-40.

26) In 1 Corinthians 1:17 ("For Christ sent me [Paul] not to baptize but to preach the gospel") Paul said Jesus was wrong when he said in Matthew 28:19 "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them…" Clearly one of these people is wrong, either way, it’s a contradiction.

27) When did Satan enter Judas? Satan entered into Judas while at the supper. John 13:27 Satan entered Judas before the supper. Luke 23:3-4 & 7

28) How many women came to the sepulcher? John 20:1 Only one woman went, Mary Magdalene. Matthew 28:1 Mary Magdalene and the "other Mary" (Jesus’ mother) went.

29) Mark 16:2 It was sunrise when the two women went to the sepulcher. John 20:1 It was still dark (before sunrise) when Mary Magdalene went alone to the sepulcher.

30) There were two angels seen by the women at the sepulcher and they were standing up. Luke 24:4 There was only one angel seen and he was sitting down. Mark 28:2-5

31) How many angels were within the sepulcher? John 20:11-12 two, Mark 16:5 one.

32) The Holy Ghost bestowed at Pentecost. Acts 1:5-8 & 2:1-4 The holy Ghost bestowed before Pentecost. John 20:22

33) Where did Jesus first appear to the eleven disciples? In a room in Jerusalem. Luke 24:32-37 On a mountain in Galilee. Matthew 28:15-17

34) Where did Christ ascend from? From Mount Olivet. Acts 1:9-12 From Bethany. Luke 24:50-51

35) Can all sins be forgiven? (Acts 13:39) All sins can be forgiven. Great, I’m happy to know God is so merciful, but wait (Mark 3:29) Cursing or blaspheming the Holy Spirit is unforgivable.

36) The Elijah mystery: (Malachi 4:5) Elijah must return before the final days of the world. (Matthew 11:12-14) Jesus said that John the Baptist was Elijah. (Matthew 17:12- 13) Jesus insists that Elijah has already come, and everyone understood him to mean John the Baptist. (Mark 9:13) Jesus insists that Elijah has already come. (John 1:21) John the Baptist maintained that he was not Elijah.

37) Who purchased the potter’s field? Acts 1:18 The field was purchased by Judas. John 20:1 The potter’s field was purchased by the chief priests.

38) Paul’s attendants heard the miraculous voice and stood speechless. Acts 9:7 Paul’s attendants did not hear the voice and were prostrate. Acts 22:9 & 26:14

39) Who bought the Sepulcher? Jacob, Josh 24:32 Abraham, Acts 7:16

40) Was it lawful for the Jews to put Christ to death? "The Jews answered him, we have a law, and by our law he ought to die." John 19:7 "The Jews therefore said unto him, It is not lawful for us to put any man to death." John 18:31

41) Has anyone ascended up to heaven? Elijah went up to heaven: "And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven." 2 Kings 2:11 "No man hath ascended up to heaven but he that came down from heaven, even the son of man." John 3:13

42) Is scripture inspired by God? "all scripture is given by inspiration of God." 2 Timothy 3:16 compared to: "But I speak this by permission and not by commandment." 1 Corinthians 7:6 "But to the rest speak I, not the Lord." 1 Corinthians 7:12 "That which I speak, I speak it not after the Lord" 2 Corinthians.
Well you should not take credit for a list a friend gave you, and chances are you have not even considered any in the list. And counterdictions will always be counterdictions to those who never do their own homework. I see this all the time. People come here flooding the post with what they believe is irrefutable information believeing they can feel secure by hiding behind a quanity of information. Yet if given the time, and the effort, I have discovered that this quanity simply melts away, if the one making the claim does his or her own homework. Yet if you don't want to believe in something, it is easier to hide behind a list from your local skeptic.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

Well you should not take credit for a list a friend gave you, and chances are you have not even considered any in the list. like I said in my previous post...I am not taking credit for the list so there wasnt much need for you to repeat it, seems that the only thing the "christians" in this thread are doing is cut and paste, figured I'd go for it too.........
.
.
no one is answering any of the questions I have come up with so far from their own personal christian opinion, all I want is a personal opinion on things, not a cut and paste from the bible. If I was standing with one of you and you had I bible... if I took it away and starting asking questions and you had to answer without quoting me a verse wold you be able to??

[JesusDiedForU]

like I said in my previous post...I am not taking credit for the list so there wasnt much need for you to repeat it, seems that the only thing the "christians" in this thread are doing is cut and paste, figured I'd go for it too.........
Everything I have cut and paste I can explain (can you say the same?) and probably have explained numerous times especially about Babylon... I mean I wrote a paper on it...

[JesusDiedForU]

no one is answering any of the questions I have come up with so far from their own personal christian opinion, all I want is a personal opinion on things, not a cut and paste from the bible. If I was standing with one of you and you had I bible... if I took it away and starting asking questions and you had to answer without quoting me a verse wold you be able to??


Debate the Bible without using the Bible?? ...What is this Bizarro world?

ALL scripture is useful in rebuking and correcting...

[FunkyPhreshMama]

so, what's the issue then...answer the questions...
and at the end of the day it still stands...go back to your christanity forum, and stop your "missionary" work on jah's people!

[synaptic aether]

what the fuck?

FunkyPhreshMama's totally right, no one is answering her and i really want you to. i've read this whole thread and all the christian posts have been indirect and avoiding crucial questions.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

what the fuck?

FunkyPhreshMama's totally right, no one is answering her and i really want you to. i've read this whole thread and all the christian posts have been indirect and avoiding crucial questions.thanks you http://www.hipforums.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif i just want direct answers... i feel like were walking in circles!

[JesusDiedForU]

so, what's the issue then...answer the questions...
and at the end of the day it still stands...go back to your christanity forum, and stop your "missionary" work on jah's people!First of all what questions have I avoided?

Second, the theme of the original post is "Do you think America is Babylon" Based of my worldview I do believe that America is Babylon and I base that off the Bible... you believe that Babylon is what... the literal acient city in Iraq... yet the descriptions in the Bible of FUTURE Babylon totally neglect the literal found in Iraq.

Furthermore, I use the Bible to back what I believe and many other theologians believe (ie Babylon is America) and you try to discredit the Bible... So naturally I will defend the Bible... which is the basis of my belief.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

i understand that the "babylon" thing was the origional thread but i think we have gone way beyond that question.............................. i thought we were having an all out debate now, and I feel like a lot of the things i have asked are being danced around but not directly answerd..

[FunkyPhreshMama]

as well, since the thread is in the rastafari forum...babylon is being refered to as "chant down bablyon" type of way, as in, what do rastafarian's belief bablyon to be, which is not just america, while it is a part of it, it is any place or thing, or belief that inslaves it's people, including the way many people have taken the teachings of christ, and turned them into an opportunity to enslave peoples, such as african colonies, india, so, i belief that what was a misunderstanding has turned into a flat out debate, and i truly belief that any faith requires just that, faith, to be accepted, which for me, the christian faith is not the answer!

[JesusDiedForU]

as well, since the thread is in the rastafari forum...babylon is being refered to as "chant down bablyon" type of way, as in, what do rastafarian's belief bablyon to be, which is not just america, while it is a part of it, it is any place or thing, or belief that inslaves it's people, including the way many people have taken the teachings of christ, and turned them into an opportunity to enslave peoples, such as african colonies, india, so, i belief that what was a misunderstanding has turned into a flat out debate, and i truly belief that any faith requires just that, faith, to be accepted, which for me, the christian faith is not the answer!
Ok but my faith has a solid foundation of evidence... that is why I believe... Just wondering... Does your faith have evidence to back up why you believe?

[synaptic aether]

JesusDiedForU you're right, you did answer all the questions. it's just that people who don't accept christianity don't usually consider christian doctrine to be someone's opinion easily.

sorry to go off topic... maybe i should have just made a thread but i don't like doing that for some reason...

i don't really care that christianity has so much evidence. i really think that it's just because it's been the most closely examined and frantically analized-to-death religion.

i've heard so much factual credit and discredit go to christian prophecies, beliefs, history that i don't want to hear it any more.

it seems like it's been taken apart and put together so much that i just can't believe any of it.

anyway, yea, america does seem like babylon. and i mean that as in how western culture finds fulfilment in materialism and our obsession with 'creature comforts'. also, our involvment in the world that doesn't agree with us.

[FunkyPhreshMama]

ok, i don't think all questions were answered....

1) How many generations were there between Abraham to David? Matthew 1:17 lists fourteen generations. Matthew 1:2 lists thirteen generations.

2) Is Paul lying? In Acts 20:35 Paul told people "to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, 'It is more blessed to give than to receive.'" Since Jesus never made such a biblical statement, isn’t Paul guilty of deception?

3) When did the leper become not a leper? (Matthew 8:13 & 8:14) Jesus healed the leper before visiting the house. (Mark 1:29-30 & 1:40-42) Jesus healed the leper after visiting Simon Peter’s house.

4) Who approached Jesus? (Matthew 8:5-7) The Centurion approached Jesus, beseeching help for a sick servant. (Luke 7:3 & 7:6-7) The Centurion did not approach Jesus. He sent friends and elders of the Jews.

5) Was she dead or just dying? (Matthew 9:18) He asked for help, saying his daughter was already dead. (Luke 8:41-42) Jairus approached Jesus for help, because his daughter was dying.

6) Just what did Jesus instruct them to take? (Matthew 10:10) Jesus instructed them not to take a staff, not to wear sandals. (Mark 6:8-9) Jesus instructed his disciples to wear sandals and take a staff on their journey.

7) When did John find out Jesus was the Messiah? (Matthew 11:2-3) While imprisoned. John the Baptist sent followers to Jesus to inquire if Jesus was the messiah. (Luke 7:18-22) While imprisoned. John the Baptist sent followers to Jesus to inquire if Jesus was the Messiah. (John 1 :29-34,36) John already knew Jesus was the Messiah.

8) Who made the request? (Matthew 20:20-21) Their mother requested that James and John, Zebedee’s children, should sit beside Jesus in his Kingdom. (Mark 10:35-37) James and John, Zebedee’s children, requested that they should sit beside Jesus in his Kingdom.

9) What animals were brought to Jesus? (Matthew 21:2-7) two of the disciples brought Jesus an ass and a colt from the village of Bethphage. (Mark 11:2-7) They brought him only a colt.

10) When did the fig tree hear of its doom? (Matthew 21:17-19) Jesus cursed the fig tree after purging the temple. (Mark 11:14-15 & 20) He cursed it before the purging.

11) When did the fig tree keel? (Matthew 21:9) The fig tree withered immediately. and the disciples registered surprise then and there. (Mark 11:12-14 & 20) The morning after Jesus cursed the fig tree, the disciples noticed it had withered and expressed astonishment.

12) Was John the Baptist Elias? "This is Elias which was to come." Matthew 11:14 "And they asked him, what then? Art thou Elias? And he said I am not." John l:21

13) Who was the father of Joseph? Matthew 1:16 The father of Joseph was Jacob. Luke 3 :23 The father of Joseph was Heli. Christians shall try to LIE and tell you that one is the heritage of Mary and the other Joseph. This is utter bullshit, the Hebrew and Greek cultures NEVER regarded the bloodline of the mother. They were patriarchal societies which only concerned themselves with paternal lineage.

14) How many generations were there from the Babylon captivity to Christ? Matthew 1:17 Fourteen generations, Matthew 1:12-16 Thirteen generations.

15) Matthew 2:15, 19 & 21-23 The infant Christ was taken into Egypt. Luke 2:22 & 39 The infant Christ was NOT taken to Egypt.

16) Matthew 5:1-2 Christ preached his first sermon on the mount. Luke 6:17 & 20 Christ preached his first sermon in the plain.

17) John was in prison when Jesus went into Galilee. Mark 1:14 John was not in prison when Jesus went into Galilee. John 1:43 & 3:22-24

18) What was the nationality of the woman who besought Jesus? Matthew 15:22 "And behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, Have mercy on me, 0 Lord, thou son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil." Mark 7:26 "The woman was a Greek, a Syrophenician by nation, and she besought him that he would cast forth the devil out of her daughter."

19) How many blind men besought Jesus? Matthew 20:30 Two blind men. Luke 18:35-38 Only one blind man.

20) Where did the devil take Jesus first? (Matthew 4:5-8) The Devil took Jesus first to the parapet of the temple, then to a high place to view all the Kingdoms of the world. (Luke 4:5-9) The Devil took Jesus first to a high place to view the kingdoms, then to the parapet of the temple.

21) Can one pray in public? (Matthew 6:5-6) Jesus condemned public prayer. (1 Timothy 2:8) Paul encouraged public prayer.

22) If we decide to do good works, should those works be seen? Matthew 5:16 "Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works." 1 Peter 2:12 "Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that ... they may by your good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation." This contradicts: Matthew 6:1-4 "Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them…that thine alms may be in secret." Matthew 23:3-5 "Do not ye after their [Pharisees'] works ... all their works they do for to be seen of men."

23) Who did Jesus tell the Lord’s Prayer to? (Matthew 5:1, 6:9-13 & 7:28) Jesus delivered the Lord’s Prayer during the Sermon on the Mount before the multitudes. (Luke 11:1-4) He delivered it before the disciples alone, and not as part of the Sermon on the Mount.

24) When was Christ crucified? Mark 15:25 "And it was the third hour and they crucified him." John 19:14-15 "And it was the preparation of the Passover, and about the sixth hour; and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your king…Shall I crucify your king?" John 19:14-15.

25) The two thieves reviled Christ. (Matthew 27:44 & Mark 15:32) Only one of the thieves reviled Christ. Luke 23:39-40.

26) In 1 Corinthians 1:17 ("For Christ sent me [Paul] not to baptize but to preach the gospel") Paul said Jesus was wrong when he said in Matthew 28:19 "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them…" Clearly one of these people is wrong, either way, it’s a contradiction.

27) When did Satan enter Judas? Satan entered into Judas while at the supper. John 13:27 Satan entered Judas before the supper. Luke 23:3-4 & 7

28) How many women came to the sepulcher? John 20:1 Only one woman went, Mary Magdalene. Matthew 28:1 Mary Magdalene and the "other Mary" (Jesus’ mother) went.

29) Mark 16:2 It was sunrise when the two women went to the sepulcher. John 20:1 It was still dark (before sunrise) when Mary Magdalene went alone to the sepulcher.

30) There were two angels seen by the women at the sepulcher and they were standing up. Luke 24:4 There was only one angel seen and he was sitting down. Mark 28:2-5

31) How many angels were within the sepulcher? John 20:11-12 two, Mark 16:5 one.

32) The Holy Ghost bestowed at Pentecost. Acts 1:5-8 & 2:1-4 The holy Ghost bestowed before Pentecost. John 20:22

33) Where did Jesus first appear to the eleven disciples? In a room in Jerusalem. Luke 24:32-37 On a mountain in Galilee. Matthew 28:15-17

34) Where did Christ ascend from? From Mount Olivet. Acts 1:9-12 From Bethany. Luke 24:50-51

35) Can all sins be forgiven? (Acts 13:39) All sins can be forgiven. Great, I’m happy to know God is so merciful, but wait (Mark 3:29) Cursing or blaspheming the Holy Spirit is unforgivable.

36) The Elijah mystery: (Malachi 4:5) Elijah must return before the final days of the world. (Matthew 11:12-14) Jesus said that John the Baptist was Elijah. (Matthew 17:12- 13) Jesus insists that Elijah has already come, and everyone understood him to mean John the Baptist. (Mark 9:13) Jesus insists that Elijah has already come. (John 1:21) John the Baptist maintained that he was not Elijah.

37) Who purchased the potter’s field? Acts 1:18 The field was purchased by Judas. John 20:1 The potter’s field was purchased by the chief priests.

38) Paul’s attendants heard the miraculous voice and stood speechless. Acts 9:7 Paul’s attendants did not hear the voice and were prostrate. Acts 22:9 & 26:14

39) Who bought the Sepulcher? Jacob, Josh 24:32 Abraham, Acts 7:16

40) Was it lawful for the Jews to put Christ to death? "The Jews answered him, we have a law, and by our law he ought to die." John 19:7 "The Jews therefore said unto him, It is not lawful for us to put any man to death." John 18:31

41) Has anyone ascended up to heaven? Elijah went up to heaven: "And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven." 2 Kings 2:11 "No man hath ascended up to heaven but he that came down from heaven, even the son of man." John 3:13

42) Is scripture inspired by God? "all scripture is given by inspiration of God." 2 Timothy 3:16 compared to: "But I speak this by permission and not by commandment." 1 Corinthians 7:6 "But to the rest speak I, not the Lord." 1 Corinthians 7:12 "That which I speak, I speak it not after the Lord" 2 Corinthians.

sorry to post these again...and no, i do not accept christian doctrine as an opinion, other then the opinion of moses, david, matthew, luke, and all the others that wrote it...i wonder why christanity has been the religion that has been under the microscope the most? maybe because most of histories horrible wars have been in the name of it? and yes, fine, it was just man using god's word...but there actions were still representing christanity!!!

[JesusDiedForU]

ok, i don't think all questions were answered....


sorry to post these again...and no, i do not accept christian doctrine as an opinion, other then the opinion of moses, david, matthew, luke, and all the others that wrote it...i wonder why christanity has been the religion that has been under the microscope the most? maybe because most of histories horrible wars have been in the name of it? and yes, fine, it was just man using god's word...but there actions were still representing christanity!!!Okay, if you want to debate contradictions in the Bible PLEASE do a few at a time so we can both really look in detail of the suppose contradictions... I could be writing for days to explain the misconceptions of the Bible : )

Yeah that is very interesting... Why is Christianity always under the microscope? I mean here you have a Jewish carpenter in the middle east claiming he is the messiah and God of all and 2000 years later He is more popular then ever throughout all of the world. I mean why did he not die off like all the rest of the false prophets. Jesus made an interesting remark when He said, "Although heaven and earth will pass away, MY WORDS will never pass away." And here we are 2000 years later and this "crazy" prophet's words have held true... quite a coincidence : )

Keep in mind that many people who say that they are Christians are not always TRUE Christians. Some are only Christians by name. For you see Jesus said that people honor Him with their lips but their hearts are far from Him. Paul states that many people believe in God but by their actions deny him. What good is forcing (ie believe or die) religion on people. Because you can SAY that you believe in God to people, but what God looks at is what your HEART says...

"There actions were still representing christanity." This is true, and gives a bad name for Christians. If only they had Bibles back then and saw what it really ment to be a Christian. Jesus said himself, "Those who live by the sword, die by the sword." Also, keep in mind no one is perfect, INCLUDING CHRISTIANS. I am far from perfect and I will be the first one to admit it : )

[JesusDiedForU]

JesusDiedForU you're right, you did answer all the questions. it's just that people who don't accept christianity don't usually consider christian doctrine to be someone's opinion easily.

sorry to go off topic... maybe i should have just made a thread but i don't like doing that for some reason...

i don't really care that christianity has so much evidence. i really think that it's just because it's been the most closely examined and frantically analized-to-death religion.

i've heard so much factual credit and discredit go to christian prophecies, beliefs, history that i don't want to hear it any more.

it seems like it's been taken apart and put together so much that i just can't believe any of it.

anyway, yea, america does seem like babylon. and i mean that as in how western culture finds fulfilment in materialism and our obsession with 'creature comforts'. also, our involvment in the world that doesn't agree with us.
Well I am glad to see that you believe Babylon is America also... However you state that you have heard so much of Christianity factual credit and discredit that you don't want to hear it anymore... That is to bad.

I just hope you understand that most of the world does not believe in Jesus nor the Bible. We are only a handful of Christians verse an unbelieving world but yet I am convinced that the evidence found in the Bible surpasses any other religion. Because of the evidence found the Bible, it gives me a foundation for my faith-A reason to believe. And also gives a skeptic what they want--proof that the Bible is the true word of God.

Don't believe in what may feel good or seems right according to the world, for the world is flawed, but rather what is true. Because truth in the end truth wins : )

[synaptic aether]

hijacking fucking christians

fucking hijacking christians

christians fucking hijackers

doing christians in the butt

christians doing it in the butt

hahahaha ^.^

[JesusDiedForU]

hijacking fucking christians

fucking hijacking christians

christians fucking hijackers

doing christians in the butt

christians doing it in the butt

hahahaha ^.^
Am I suppose to reply to that?