Vedas online?

[TrippinBTM]

Are there any sites where I can read the Vedas? Or the Bagavad Gita? I found one site (http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/) but it's a pain in the ass, the pages are so short that you keep having to go back to the index. If anyone knows of any better ones, you'd save me a lot of time looking around through sites that only talk about them, rather than let you read them. Same goes for the Gita. Thanks for your help people.

[BlackBillBlake]

Sri Aurobindo's translation of the Gita can be found at


http://intyoga.bravepages.com/bg_idx.htm

There are other texts here too, not the Vedas but some upanishads.

Swamai Prabhupada's version, Bhagavad Gita as it is, can be found at

http://www.asitis.com/gallery/

Edwin Arnold' 1885 translation

http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/gita/

I don't know if the text of the original four Vedas is available online.

Love & Peace.

[Bhaskar]

The vedas are intuitively available to all who tune in.

[Bhaskar]

...kinda like PBS :P

[BlackBillBlake]

So why bother taking the trouble to read anything at all? I doubt that through intuition one would arrive at the actual words of the Rishis. Which is presumably the reason they were written down in the first place.

[Bhaskar]

a. Not everyone is able to tune in.

b. I never said the exact words of the vedas may be derived intuitively, but the entire philosophical content therein is available to one and all.

c. The actual words are written in such a way as to have certain vibrations which create subtle positive changes to the persons chanting and their environment.

[Bhaskar]

Besides our reception may not always be fully clear.

[BlackBillBlake]

a. Not everyone is able to tune in.

b. I never said the exact words of the vedas may be derived intuitively, but the entire philosophical content therein is available to one and all.

c. The actual words are written in such a way as to have certain vibrations which create subtle positive changes to the persons chanting and their environment.
Please understand I'm not just being argumentative here. I have a problem with point b. above - I don't know that the entire philosophical content of the Vedas is at all widely understood. The usual line taken with regard to the Vedas, is that they contain mainly instructions for ritual, and that the end proposed is enjoyment of both earthly and heavenly pleasures etc. The upanishads, which date from a later period than Rig Veda, are more generally understood as the philosophical basis of vedanta.
However, in recent times the traditional view of the Veda. which is based more or less upon the work of a single commentator, Sayana, has been thrown into question by the work of Sri Aurobindo, who discovered a sense in the Veda which is somewhat different to either Sayana's or western scholarly analysis of the meaning of the Riks.
Sri Aurobindo's interpretation seems to be more in line with the truth of the matter, to me anyway. And the conclusion is that the Vedic Rishis possessed a knowledge and an experience which became obscured later on, and of which all the later upanishads and so on are only a partial reflection.
This is one view of the Veda - And I don't see how one could tune into it without having some preliminary intellectual concept of the actual content of the Veda. To get that you'd have to read it - but even there problems arise, even for those versed in sanskrit, as the language of the Rishis is of an archaic form, unintelligible to anyone but a specialist. And many translations into english are based on traditional and somewhat limited views.
If you are at all intrested in Sri Aurobindo's view and translation, I recommend 'The Secret of the Veda'. Not so far as I know available online.
Myself, I feel that Sr A. discovered a truth that has lain hidden for millenia, so I do consider this an important point.

[BlackBillBlake]

I've actually posted this elsewhere in these forums before, but here anyway are a few gems from the Rig Veda trans. Sri Aurobindo.


Vanished the darkness, shaken in its foundation; Heaven shone out ; upward rose the light of the Divine Dawn; the sun entered the vast fields of the Truth beholding the straight things and the crooked in mortals. Thereafter indeed they awoke and saw utterly by the sun's separation of the straight from the crooked, the truth from the falsehood; then indeed they held in them the bliss that is enjoyed in heaven

Rig Veda IV.I. I7

May he the knower discern perfectly the Knowledge and the Ignorance, the wide levels and the crooked that shut in mortals; and, oh God, for a bliss fruitful in offspring , lavish on us Diti, and protect Aditi.

Rig Veda IV.2.1

Now as the seven seers of Dawn, the Mother, the supreme disposers of the sacrifice, may we beget for ourselves the Gods; may we become the Angirasas, sons of Heaven, breaking open the wealth-filled hill, shining in purity.

Rig Veda IV.2.15

We have done the work for thee, we have become perfect in works, the wide-shining Dawns have taken up their home in the Truth, in the fullness of Agni and His manifold delight, in the shining eye of the God in all His brightness.

Rig Veda 1V.2.1

[Bhaskar]

I apologise for not being accurate in my wording. What I was referring to is the philosophy of vedanta, rather than the rituals and the other worldly sciences described there.

The knowledge and experience of the vedic rishis is just as available today. Those who have achieved enlightenment, the Ramanas the Aurobindos, the Chinmayanandas of our age have the same experience and knowledge of these rishis. The difference is that the later masters didnt bother with worldly sciences because right now the world is already suffused with that, thereofre according to the ned of the times they explained the same philosophy.

The concept of brahman is available to all. The sense of oneness is available to all. Why? Because that experience, that brahman is our true self and it shines through us in moments of silence and insight. That is what I refer to as tuning in.

[BlackBillBlake]

Thanks Bhaskar, but the whole point of my earlier post was that according to Sri Aurobindo, the Veda doesn't just deal with Rituals and occult sciences, but gives a path of spiritual realization, which has become obscured.

[Bhaskar]

I dont think it has become obscured at all. The content of vedanta is very much available and kicking. The bhagawad geeta explains the same things (it is often referred to as the fifth veda). The upanishads, which are the sections of the vedas dealing directly with spirituality, are still available. There is no dearth of teachers who travel around the wrld explaining their meanings.

The rituals in the karma kanda are what have been obscured over time. If you observe religious rites today (and I have been through several of them in my time) the priest just rushes through it and the meaning and the symbolism of it is lost. Often thier pronunciation of mantras isnt very good. Therefore the effect for which we perform the ritual may not come about, or it may be reversed. The trouble is it is being done for the sake of being done and therefore it is not done right. Over several centuries this has been happening and therefore the rites have been obscured. Of course there are stray pockets where some people still do them correctly, but those are few and far between.

As for other occult sciences, they are completely and totally lost. I doubt if there is a single practitioner in the world who interprets and follows them correctly. Most of them are get rich quick blokes, who use people's credulousness to exploit them.

It is the upanishads that have survived the test of time.

[BlackBillBlake]

Dear Bhaskar,
I agree with most of what you say. I'm afraid that as usual, when I try to explain something of Sri Aurobindo's work I have not expressed it too well. In effect, what He says is really only in connection with the Rig Veda. And really it amounts to this - that the Rishis used a symbolic language to encapsulate certain experiences, and the true meaning of the language and symbolism has not been truly understood for many thousands of years. He is not suggesting that this applies to the Upanishads , the Gita or any shastra of later date.
I'm afraid that the nature of Sri A's findings is too complex and requires too much explanation for me to go into here.All I can do is recommend Sri A's Secret of the Veda, and one other book, which you might find in India, 'The Veda and Indian Culture' by Kireet Joshi (Motilal Banarsidass), which is an excellent summary study in a quite condensed form. Unfortunately, there is not much online on this particular topic.
For the most part, I think people are better off reading the Upanishads and later works, because as you say, thats the basis, but it is interesting to see the significance that a great Seer like Sri Aurobindo extracted from the Rig Veda.

Om Shanti.

[Bhaskar]

I understand that the symbolism encoded in the scriptures is far too complex for any but the most finest of intellects to comprehend. The structure of the sanskrit language is such that words can be split and different menings extracted so a sentence may have a hundred various meanings if you can delve deeper and deeper. The beauty of the scriptures is that it is impossible to find a meaning that contradicts at any point. Such a multi layered magnificence indeed is challenging to say the least. Therefore, I understand and accept Sri Aurobindo's point.

I just thought that I would mention that the upanishads are not later texts, but are a part of the vedas. The last portion of the each veda contains upanishads. The aitreya upanishad for example, is a part of the Rig veda.

[BlackBillBlake]

Dear Bhaskar,
I don't want to go on disputing these points because I see no point. For the majority of western people, the Rig Veda is very inaccessible. IMHO people are better off to begin reading works such as the Gita and Upanishads, or the works of great gurus past or present - although of course, the guru is ever present!

Om Shanti.

[Bhaskar]

So wha is the dispute about? I agree with you entirely.