~Sam~
10-11-2004, 10:12 PM
We had just come back from the store. I wanted some wine to spill as tribute to my Mom after I spread her ashes in the rock garden and under the Grave Post I had carved for her and Dad.
Being hungry too, we stopped and picked up a couple of Subway sandwiches while we were out. I had gotten a head start on the wine, and went down by the lower deck to go to the bathroom. There, on that half weathered hay bale I had squirted shroom spore on, grew a second crop of primo shrooms. I picked all of them, it being Nov. 1st, they wouldn't grow too much more anyway. Not knowing what to do with them, I put them on the open wrapper of my Sub. You know how an Italian Sub goes all witchy-ways when you're eating it? Well, the sky had gone twilight on us and I couldn't see too good, and the shrooms, a goodly handful of them, got all mixed up with the Sub fixings and I ate them.
About a half an hour later, after I had spread Mom's cremains, lit the candles, and settled on the bench with Ken, the colors started to come on. Good colors... good voices too. The messages I heard from my mother were short and sweet; "Don't worry about the Other Side until you get there"... my Mom always said in life; "Let the dead take care of the dead, and the living take care of the living." Good words. She also asked me that night, quite distinctly, "Marsha! Where are your goats?"
I had not had any critters for 14 years... I felt well enough again, so I began looking on the Internet for Alpine Dairy Goats for sale. I found the ones I wanted and contacted the folks down in West Virginia. This was Nov. 2, 2003. On Nov. 14th, I had me a black 1996 GMC Sierra half ton 4x4 pick up truck, and Kenny and I were on our way to Oh My God! West Virginia to buy us some goats.
When we arrived, down an honest-to-god, real Holler... we found some truly fine goats and some truly fine, but wacked out goat people.
The goats we purchased are well documented in this forum, but the follow-up is not....
Now, I have almost 34 years experience with goat husbandry. This woman has been raising them for about 5 years. But, do I get any respect for the knowledge I have... NFW. I get phone calls and advise.
It's not that I mind advise, and I had the patience to weather most of the 2 hour long calls and complaints... But!
You see, these folks were city-fied through and through. Not an ounce of common sense between them. The woman had married a GI stationed in her homeland of Germany, and moved to Chicago, USA 20 years ago. The fella, her 2nd husband, was an Ad Exec from Chicago. When his company went belly-up, he took the buy-out option and with the monies from that, they bought this severely rundown trailer at the bottom of a steep hillside, next to a good size stream that floods everytime it rains.
I guess they were into Survivalism back about 5 years, and figured that milking goats were the perfect animal for meat and milk when the world went to pot.
Anyway, if you're into selling milk (all the milk you produce) and have a market for goat kids in the Spring, go ahead and breed everyone who comes into heat in the fall. But, if you don't... you wind up with a goat population explosion. Which is where we found these two hillbillies.
The muck in the goat yard was 8 inches deep because they keep on gettin' flooded out. The goats were overcrowded... and her system of feeding and milking was just about the most inane piece of thinking I've ever had the misfortune to witness.
She feeds every goat, milking and dry, on the milk stand... One-by-One! With 20 some goats, this could take hours and is stupid, pure and simple. She also bottle feeds her kids individually. (I feed everyone here free choice. I have feeders to match head count, and when I feed kids I feed 'em three at a time. One bottle in each hand and one between my knees.)
And even though she has some good stock, you don't keep every buck kid born to you for future breeding purposes. Only breed to the best of the best is my motto. It's the way you improve the breed.
Now get this, these folks are dirt poor. They have no source of income. Yet they are putting themselves into deep debt by buying grain and hay on their Visa card. She also has her goats on DHIA, dairy herd improvement association. This is a gov't run program that has a 'tester' come to your farm once a month, for two consecutive milkings, to weigh the amount of milk and butterfat each goat produces in a 24 hour period. The purpose of this program is for commercial dairymen. It tells the farmer with a lot of critters which ones to cull and which ones to keep. Which goats to breed and which to keep in milk. It tracks the records of daughters and their production records. This verifies just how the Buck they used for breeding is improving the milk production for his daughters.
But, most goat farmers use this program to sell their goat kids. A documented record of milk production and length of lactation... it's not for this use... These folks are paying $125/mo for this service... And! get this, they're not selling milk or kids! No market.
I'll make this long story shorter now...
After 10 months of phone calls and advise and complaints... mostly complaints about being flooded out with their goats standing in 10 inches of water, health problems with her goats, feeding problems and not being able to find hay, not being able to sell any buck kids.... I had had it with her.
I came right out and told her I had sold Joline and two of her doe kids. I sold them because they were the complainingest, loudest, most unruly goats I've ever heard. They were driving me insane. And there's just no reason to put up with that kind of nonsense from an animal whom you're giving your all to. And to be quite frank about the whole thing; it's just not my job to pull my friend's heads out of their asses.
I haven't heard from her in weeks... but I won't hold my breath, that phone call will come.
Dad... I try to stay away from the goat world for the most part. As you said; "It's obsessive-compulsive." There's all kinds of info out there to help you raise healthy critters. Mostly though, it's in the eye of the husbander. When you get to know your animals, and you go out to the barn... take some time to look at the way they're getting along. If something's wrong, you can tell.
One thing I've found with goats; They're outrageously rugged, but if they get sick and go down, forget about it. They're down for the count.
But if you let them roam and browse, keep them in well ventilated quarters, give them good hay and worm them regularly, you won't have too many problems. You're fortunate to have those folks that you bought your goats from nearby. Good Luck with your new girls, Dad. It's a real adventure, ain't it?
Sam
PS. Just got back in from the barn. As I was proof reading this post, the Vet knocked on the door. What did I tell ya.
Being hungry too, we stopped and picked up a couple of Subway sandwiches while we were out. I had gotten a head start on the wine, and went down by the lower deck to go to the bathroom. There, on that half weathered hay bale I had squirted shroom spore on, grew a second crop of primo shrooms. I picked all of them, it being Nov. 1st, they wouldn't grow too much more anyway. Not knowing what to do with them, I put them on the open wrapper of my Sub. You know how an Italian Sub goes all witchy-ways when you're eating it? Well, the sky had gone twilight on us and I couldn't see too good, and the shrooms, a goodly handful of them, got all mixed up with the Sub fixings and I ate them.
About a half an hour later, after I had spread Mom's cremains, lit the candles, and settled on the bench with Ken, the colors started to come on. Good colors... good voices too. The messages I heard from my mother were short and sweet; "Don't worry about the Other Side until you get there"... my Mom always said in life; "Let the dead take care of the dead, and the living take care of the living." Good words. She also asked me that night, quite distinctly, "Marsha! Where are your goats?"
I had not had any critters for 14 years... I felt well enough again, so I began looking on the Internet for Alpine Dairy Goats for sale. I found the ones I wanted and contacted the folks down in West Virginia. This was Nov. 2, 2003. On Nov. 14th, I had me a black 1996 GMC Sierra half ton 4x4 pick up truck, and Kenny and I were on our way to Oh My God! West Virginia to buy us some goats.
When we arrived, down an honest-to-god, real Holler... we found some truly fine goats and some truly fine, but wacked out goat people.
The goats we purchased are well documented in this forum, but the follow-up is not....
Now, I have almost 34 years experience with goat husbandry. This woman has been raising them for about 5 years. But, do I get any respect for the knowledge I have... NFW. I get phone calls and advise.
It's not that I mind advise, and I had the patience to weather most of the 2 hour long calls and complaints... But!
You see, these folks were city-fied through and through. Not an ounce of common sense between them. The woman had married a GI stationed in her homeland of Germany, and moved to Chicago, USA 20 years ago. The fella, her 2nd husband, was an Ad Exec from Chicago. When his company went belly-up, he took the buy-out option and with the monies from that, they bought this severely rundown trailer at the bottom of a steep hillside, next to a good size stream that floods everytime it rains.
I guess they were into Survivalism back about 5 years, and figured that milking goats were the perfect animal for meat and milk when the world went to pot.
Anyway, if you're into selling milk (all the milk you produce) and have a market for goat kids in the Spring, go ahead and breed everyone who comes into heat in the fall. But, if you don't... you wind up with a goat population explosion. Which is where we found these two hillbillies.
The muck in the goat yard was 8 inches deep because they keep on gettin' flooded out. The goats were overcrowded... and her system of feeding and milking was just about the most inane piece of thinking I've ever had the misfortune to witness.
She feeds every goat, milking and dry, on the milk stand... One-by-One! With 20 some goats, this could take hours and is stupid, pure and simple. She also bottle feeds her kids individually. (I feed everyone here free choice. I have feeders to match head count, and when I feed kids I feed 'em three at a time. One bottle in each hand and one between my knees.)
And even though she has some good stock, you don't keep every buck kid born to you for future breeding purposes. Only breed to the best of the best is my motto. It's the way you improve the breed.
Now get this, these folks are dirt poor. They have no source of income. Yet they are putting themselves into deep debt by buying grain and hay on their Visa card. She also has her goats on DHIA, dairy herd improvement association. This is a gov't run program that has a 'tester' come to your farm once a month, for two consecutive milkings, to weigh the amount of milk and butterfat each goat produces in a 24 hour period. The purpose of this program is for commercial dairymen. It tells the farmer with a lot of critters which ones to cull and which ones to keep. Which goats to breed and which to keep in milk. It tracks the records of daughters and their production records. This verifies just how the Buck they used for breeding is improving the milk production for his daughters.
But, most goat farmers use this program to sell their goat kids. A documented record of milk production and length of lactation... it's not for this use... These folks are paying $125/mo for this service... And! get this, they're not selling milk or kids! No market.
I'll make this long story shorter now...
After 10 months of phone calls and advise and complaints... mostly complaints about being flooded out with their goats standing in 10 inches of water, health problems with her goats, feeding problems and not being able to find hay, not being able to sell any buck kids.... I had had it with her.
I came right out and told her I had sold Joline and two of her doe kids. I sold them because they were the complainingest, loudest, most unruly goats I've ever heard. They were driving me insane. And there's just no reason to put up with that kind of nonsense from an animal whom you're giving your all to. And to be quite frank about the whole thing; it's just not my job to pull my friend's heads out of their asses.
I haven't heard from her in weeks... but I won't hold my breath, that phone call will come.
Dad... I try to stay away from the goat world for the most part. As you said; "It's obsessive-compulsive." There's all kinds of info out there to help you raise healthy critters. Mostly though, it's in the eye of the husbander. When you get to know your animals, and you go out to the barn... take some time to look at the way they're getting along. If something's wrong, you can tell.
One thing I've found with goats; They're outrageously rugged, but if they get sick and go down, forget about it. They're down for the count.
But if you let them roam and browse, keep them in well ventilated quarters, give them good hay and worm them regularly, you won't have too many problems. You're fortunate to have those folks that you bought your goats from nearby. Good Luck with your new girls, Dad. It's a real adventure, ain't it?
Sam
PS. Just got back in from the barn. As I was proof reading this post, the Vet knocked on the door. What did I tell ya.