Hell

[Razorofoccam]

Man created hell..
The desire to live forever is the blind stupidity of a grasping hand with no mind.
Nothing compares with the horror of immortality. Thank reality u and i will die.
We last ~70 years. Mountins ~20 million years. Suns.~20 billion, The universe.~300 billion.
Only REALITY is eternal. It has to BE.

Occam

[BlackBillBlake]

Only REALITY is eternal. It has to BE.

OccamWhat is 'reality'?

Why does it have to be?

[XBloodyNailPolishX]

I don't see why living forever would be so bad... sure, it would be sad to see so many people die; but I'm sure the wisdom of hundreds, thousands of years of experience would surely help you to understand it better.

[xexon]

You already live forever, but you can't see it through the human identity you now wear.

Hell is the process that will help you disrobe.

It makes you uncomfortable so you want to move forward and therefore away from an earthly existance and all the limitations that comes with it. In your divine state, neither hell or time has any meaning to you.


x

[yyyesiam2]

man created hell? could you elaborate?

[stev90]

Man creates hell when he marries woman.

It can of course, turn out to be heaven, depending on karma.:leaving:

[Bradley1107]

In my mind, Hell is a place on Earth. Its a state of being that you can put yourself in by doing foolish, greedy, evil things.

Eternal life, in my opinion, has nothing to do with our individual egos or anything like that. It simply means that we are all a part of something that is eternal.

I would also add that anything involving words is man made. Just because something is "man made" does not mean it bears no truth. And an ancient practice, especially in spritual matters is to express universal truths in the form of metaphors and poetic language. Partly because the literal truth surpasses the limits of our minds and our langauges. Partly because these truths cannot simply be understood intelectually. They have to resonate with you deep down, and engage your imagination and spirit, and metaphors are especially good at doing that kind of thing.

Just an opinion

[XBloodyNailPolishX]

The Christian "Hell" is a false idea used to scare people into obedience.

[Bradley1107]

I would urge you to look a bit deeper than that. I dont dispute the fact that it has been used for that reason though

[Okiefreak]

In my mind, Hell is a place on Earth. Its a state of being that you can put yourself in by doing foolish, greedy, evil things.

Eternal life, in my opinion, has nothing to do with our individual egos or anything like that. It simply means that we are all a part of something that is eternal.

I would also add that anything involving words is man made. Just because something is "man made" does not mean it bears no truth. And an ancient practice, especially in spritual matters is to express universal truths in the form of metaphors and poetic language. Partly because the literal truth surpasses the limits of our minds and our langauges. Partly because these truths cannot simply be understood intelectually. They have to resonate with you deep down, and engage your imagination and spirit, and metaphors are especially good at doing that kind of thing.

Just an opinionI've come to exactly the same conclusion. It's amazing to find somebody else who thinks like I do. I'm still and Okie, but I don't feel like as much of a freak.

[themnax]

reality is what is left when we stop lying to ourselves, stop inventing expectations because we get off on doing so and then forgetting that is the only reason that we have.

nothing HAS TO be anything. that's really our own ego again, the idea that anything does.

yet there certainly are things we don't even have to pretend to know anything about to feel and experience. is the feeling and experiencing of them, in some sense not "real"?

that our awairness might continue in some form, without mind or memory that depend upon algorathyms running on a physiological brain, supported by a metabolizing and reproducing organism is not THAT inconceivable. nor that it might submerge into some unfathemable alll encompassing wholeness at the end of the organism's span, only to reemerge in the birth of another living organism, on some other life bearing tangable material world.

the idea that one state of being, the MIGHT exist beyond this one, might last for ever, is no more compellingly intuitive to me, then the requirement for us to know or understand anything in order for it to exist.

this may be a little off the subject, but i feel directly related, that if we see everything our priest(s), rabi, immam, guru, shaman, local spiritual assembly, what have you, doesn't tell us to worship, as an advisary or enimy, we become ourselves brutes and monsters.

if we treat everyone and everything, seen and unseen alike, as a potential friend, we will still get bitten, occasionally beat over the head, disliked, though perhaps a little less often, even sometimes hated for no obvious appearent reason, but my bet is, whether in poverty or wealth, we will live much happier and more gratifying lives, and certain have better chances of maintaining a legitimately clear conscience.

and isn't dying with a guilty conscience and or an unsatisfied life, what all this "hell" bussiness is really all about?

=^^=
.../\...

[stev90]

Partly because the literal truth surpasses the limits of our minds and our langauges. Partly because these truths cannot simply be understood intelectually. They have to resonate with you deep down, and engage your imagination and spirit, and metaphors are especially good at doing that kind of thing.

Just an opinionHow the fuck did you figure this out, if you say, these "truths" whatever the hell they are, cannot be understood intellectually??


If "these truths cannot simply be understood intellectually", did you use your ass to grasp and unlock these profound "truths"???

:talk2hand

[yyyesiam2]

through experience. the intellect can serve to communicate stories about these experiences, but the person hearing the story would have to experience it themselves to fully understand.

[hippie_chick666]

^^^^
Right on! I totally agree. Intellectually, the mind cannot grasp these concepts. The awareness behind the thinker (mind/ego/whatever you want to call it) experiences the Divine connection we all have w/ each other. The mind denies this connection- perhaps read one of Echart Tolle's books. Good explanations on these ideas. Also, Wayne Dyer's a good author on the same subject.

Side note, when I bought "A New Earth," it was on clearance for $3.99- now that Oprah promoted it, the book's a best seller. It is really good though, and I'm glad that books aiming to awaken people are becoming more acceptable in out society, when they have been marginalized as "New Age-y" as if that's an insult.

Peace and love

[Razorofoccam]

What is 'reality'?

Why does it have to be?Bill

It has to be or there is nothing.
If nothing is real there is no-thing.

A fundamental philosophical thought
What is the total absence of anything..What is MORE INFINITE
than space or time?
Absolute non-existance
the human mind cannot grasp it.ever.
Lets just say
You and i are talking.. . so existance IS.
[I talk to bill ..therefore i am]

Occam

PS WHY does it HAVE TO BE.?
It is not an On/Off state.
This is what you question?
There can be no On/Off without the On.

There can be no OFF. Only on. And On ponders the Off.. to no avail.
;)
Thus Reality HAS ALWAYS EXISTED.

[Razorofoccam]

Themnax

The great Speculative writer P K Dick was once asked
'what is real' ?
[Total recall. the Matrix.Payday.Imposter.Blade runner.Minority report.exct]

His answer

'Reality is that which,
when you stop believing in it, does not go away'

Occam

[themnax]

well there doesn't really have to not be nothing, only for us to experince it and for there to be an us to do so. but there's nothing that requires there to be an us, or anything else, just the preferences of us and other unimaginable things to exist in order to be able to.

and do us, or even they/it, have that much to say about it? i don't think that's something any of us will ever know, as is whether or not it/they do either.

=^^=
.../\...

[Razorofoccam]

Themnax

We online at same time.. Hi my friend

Occam