Very Important Question

[The Guardian]

A little background. I have smoked daily for about 2 years now, and have tripped shrooms 7 times. I recently met a guy who regularly makes DMT. I've talked to people who've bought it from him and they said it's safe. So I can get it.

Three out of the 7 times I have tripped shrooms, I have seizured and blacked out right at the peak. The only other time in my life that I seizured was the first and last time I attempted to donate blood. I'm not afraid of needles, and she drained the entire pint and I felt fine. But as soon as she switched the flow to take a sample, I seizured and blacked out.

I've read online that seizuring is a negative side effect of shrooms, but is generally attributed to taking too much and mixing with other drugs or alcohol. My question is this, Do you think DMT will cause me to seizure if I take it? Has anyone heard of someone seizuring from DMT?

DISCLAIMER**I am interested in your answer to the question, not opinion on whether or not I should continue taking drugs. I do not care. Regardless of what I find out, I will most likely end up trying DMT. So please just give me your honest opinion. Thank you.

[dd3stp233]

Well from your post, you sound like you are prone to seizures for some reason or other. I don't think dmt can cause them in and of itself but due to the intensity and possible stress associated with that, it may lower your threshold for having one. Since I'm not a doctor this is just my lowly opinion.

[36fuckin5]

It may be a blood pressure problem, in which case, it may not be a great idea to smoke DMT. Talk with a doctor.

[StayLoose1011]

I know that LSD lowers the threshold for seizures, and I can't imagine DMT wouldn't do the same, perhaps even more so. If you are worried about having a seizure, I probably wouldn't do DMT. However, you kept doing shrooms after having a seizure, so I guess it's not that big a deal to you.

[peacegrow]

In some ways you are lucky that the timing of your seizures are so predictable. I had a friend who was prone to seizures and she had that at the worst times, but never while tripping AFAIK. If your seizures are very scary for you, then it might make the onset of DMT scary because you may think you are having a seizure. But, you'll probably be fine once you make it to that DMT space and realize _everything_ is okay.

[Shapeshifter]

Honestly, I think you will not have time to have a seizure. It just hits you so fast and plenty of things happening so fast that you don't have time for seizure hahaha

[SQUIDPUPPY]

[QUOTE=StayLoose1011]I know that LSD lowers the threshold for seizures, ...................................... Would you have any sort of data to back up that claim??????......... Maybe there is some study that shows it, but I have certainly never heard of such.... C'mon, I mean I used to end up doing a few hundred hits a year, and I've never, not once had a seizure------ SQUID

[dd3stp233]

[QUOTE=StayLoose1011]I know that LSD lowers the threshold for seizures, ...................................... Would you have any sort of data to back up that claim??????......... Maybe there is some study that shows it, but I have certainly never heard of such.... C'mon, I mean I used to end up doing a few hundred hits a year, and I've never, not once had a seizure------ SQUIDI think its that it may only lower the thresold in people that are prone to having seizures, not that it can cause them in any way in non-seizure prone individuals.

[sYcHoNaUt2]

Its impossible to say. I think DMT is one of the safes drugs you can do (physically).
But every drug reacts differently to people. For example although shrooms cause seizures in you, a equivalent of LSD might give you an amazing trip. You may even find that LSD in extremely high doses has no trigger to your seizures at all.

In my non-professional opinion your seizures are likely due to the psilocin molecule (what causes you to trip from shrooms) in of itself. In fact I would bet money that your brain chemistry reacts adversely to psilocin but not LSD, DMT or any other psychedelics. The biggest thing you will probably run into is anxiety in thinking you are about to have a seizure while you are on these other drugs, and then having a anxiety attack or other trip related difficulties.
Good luck though. DMT is amazing. Remember what they say about it (a lot of people don't like low doses of DMT): "If you think you've done too much, you haven't done enough"

[Jack_Straw2208]

[QUOTE=StayLoose1011]I know that LSD lowers the threshold for seizures, ...................................... Would you have any sort of data to back up that claim??????......... Maybe there is some study that shows it, but I have certainly never heard of such.... C'mon, I mean I used to end up doing a few hundred hits a year, and I've never, not once had a seizure------ SQUIDGEE IT SURE IS A GOOD THING ALL OF OUR CENTRAL NERVOUS SYSTEMS ARE EXACTLY THE SAME AS YOURS!

[zilla939]

I'm with shapeshifter on this one -- The onset hits really fast, and the entire trip lasts max about 10 minutes. It's not like mushrooms or LSD at all... but it might help us to know what generally triggers your seizures within the trip... any patterns?

[Cohn]

Afaik Psilocin is sort of capsuled in the chemistry containing DMT that makes it possible to ingest it without having our enzyms in our body destroying it, so we can "trip" longer on the DMT.. (Like a Ayahuasca trip without the need to combine to differant plants. )

In other words mushroom is DMT, hope this helps.

Magic mushrooms comes from the aliens! =) Heh


Cohn

[36fuckin5]

Afaik Psilocin is sort of capsuled in the chemistry containing DMT that makes it possible to ingest it without having our enzyms in our body destroying it, so we can "trip" longer on the DMT.. (Like a Ayahuasca trip without the need to combine to differant plants. )

In other words mushroom is DMT, hope this helps.

Magic mushrooms comes from the aliens! =) Heh


Cohn
Psilocin is 4-HO-DMT. Not at all the same as N,n-DMT. It's not much like an ayahuasca trip at all.

[Cohn]

Psilocin is 4-HO-DMT. Not at all the same as N,n-DMT. It's not much like an ayahuasca trip at all.
4-Hydroxy-N,N-dimethyl-tryptamine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psilocin




4-Phosphoryloxy-N,N-dimethyl-tryptamine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psilocybin

Where am I wrong?

[Jack_Straw2208]

4-Hydroxy-N,N-dimethyl-tryptamine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psilocin




4-Phosphoryloxy-N,N-dimethyl-tryptamine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psilocybin

Where am I wrong?the "MA" of MDMA stands for Methamphetamine. MDMA is not methamphetamine. They both make you go fast, but they still have HUGE GAPING differences.

DMT and 4 HO DMT both make you trip, but they still have HUGE GAPING differences. they are two completely different chemicals.

everybody's DNA is something like 99.9% the same, that means all of the adenine, cytocine, thylamine, and guanine (the 4 molecule-bits that make up the entire 9 feet of code in every cell in your body) is 99.9 percent the same. does that mean we're all the same person?

maybe if you've had enough musha-hayusca =P

[Cohn]

the "MA" of MDMA stands for Methamphetamine. MDMA is not methamphetamine. They both make you go fast, but they still have HUGE GAPING differences.

DMT and 4 HO DMT both make you trip, but they still have HUGE GAPING differences. they are two completely different chemicals.

everybody's DNA is something like 99.9% the same, that means all of the adenine, cytocine, thylamine, and guanine (the 4 molecule-bits that make up the entire 9 feet of code in every cell in your body) is 99.9 percent the same. does that mean we're all the same person?

maybe if you've had enough musha-hayusca =PThink I might be misunderstood...

Im not talking about the whole Psilocybin as it would be pure DMT... Im talking about that it's possible to extract the DMT out from Psilocybin? (If you knew a good method that is)


I know we are not all the same person, but that doesn't make it that my body consist of _other_ chemical than yours? Like your talking about DNA all of the sudden, please do stick to the point of Psilocybin and DMT.
I don't talk about my DNA beeing the same as yours.. Geez.

I was more or less meaning that Psilocybin has DMT capsuled in the structure.. (?)

Im far from an expert in this field, are you?
If so, please DO explain me where I am wrong in me saying that Psilocybin might not be good for the thread starter in the way he gets seizure from DMT.. Was only trying to help in a way that it might makes sense, but since 2 of you claim im wrong (or you misunderstood me)

I know I might be wrong, but I might also have a point here, no?

Have a nice day! =)



Cohn..

[quorpe]

I read somewhere that DMT increases blood pressure, heart rate and body temperature among other things. So it may be dangerous for you to try it mate.

[polymer]

the "MA" of MDMA stands for Methamphetamine. MDMA is not methamphetamine. They both make you go fast, but they still have HUGE GAPING differences.

DMT and 4 HO DMT both make you trip, but they still have HUGE GAPING differences. they are two completely different chemicals.

everybody's DNA is something like 99.9% the same, that means all of the adenine, cytocine, thylamine, and guanine (the 4 molecule-bits that make up the entire 9 feet of code in every cell in your body) is 99.9 percent the same. does that mean we're all the same person?

maybe if you've had enough musha-hayusca =Pcomparing base groups differentials of DNA and comparing functional groups on a single molecule is like comparing facial plastic-surgery to a haircut.

psilocin is actually VERY similar to DMT, differing mainly by potency. DMT has slightly less affinity to 5HT2A, but I'm pretty sure 30mg of pure psilocin would have similar effects to 50mg DMT (vaporised), albeit longevity differs.
the lone hydroxy competes with the resonance of the benzene ring for electron density, but not enough to make a large difference chemically or pharmacologically

as for the methyledioxy moeity on MDMA...there's a lot of electrostatics between the two oxygens, of course its not going to be the same as methamphetamine.

sorry for speaking esoterically.

yeah, ayahuasca is going to feel different than either psilocin or DMT (vaporised), because beta-carbolines have their own intrinsic/somatic effects.

[sidd]

DMT and 4-ho-dmt a very similar it is the same thing except the DMT molecule has a HO in the 4th place with makes it active when human eat it.

A lot of times seizures at peaks and intense psychedelic experiences are peoples brain shutting down because it can’t handle that much.

You can always try just taking smaller amount and working your way up and see if it agrees with you. As long as it is just a blackout and your not swallowing your tongue or something like that.

One good hit like 20mgs usually give people a nice experience and good visuals without being full-blown trip to another universe.

I agree with a lot of the before post about worrying and causing your self to trip out on the anxiety it can be easy to do especially with something with a fast onset like DMT.

[Jack_Straw2208]

what im trying to say is that just because the chemicals are really similar, doesnt mean that they are the same. psilocybin and DMT are 2 completely different chemicals with completely different effects, even though they're so structurally similar. everybody is completely different, even though their genetic makeup is 99.9% the same.


Afaik Psilocin is sort of capsuled in the chemistry containing DMT that makes it possible to ingest it without having our enzyms in our body destroying it, so we can "trip" longer on the DMT.. (Like a Ayahuasca trip without the need to combine to differant plants. )
In other words mushroom is DMT
it seems like he's trying to say that the effects from ayahuasca and mushrooms are basically the same.

[Cohn]

it seems like he's trying to say that the effects from ayahuasca and mushrooms are basically the same.I never said the effects was the same.
But the point on his seizures might be something of the like (similar) since you as well are saying it's 99.9% the same.

No, im trying to explain to the thread starter wich was worried about DMT beeing a factor here.

I know that it's not the same, but that doesn't mean it doesn't mimic each other in the way that he might get problems from it.

I tried explaining as the 4 HO DMT is sort of capsuled so our enzyms doesn't break it down in our stomach.. (On this I might be wrong, but according to T.Mckenna he explains this. - Also saying something about it's structure beeing one of a kind in the nature. Hence why I was also saying it's from the "aliens")


Respect psycedelics and nature!



Have a nice day! =)



Cohn

[zilla939]

son i do believe mckenna went right over your head.

[sidd]

The difference effect of DMT and 4-ho-dmt is a complicated and unclear subject. It is the DMT that gets people high but the way the body metabolizes it is different and unknown.

Ayahuasca has other chemicals besides dmt so it is not that great of a comparison but oral DMT with a MAOI compared to 4-ho-dmt is a different high but still the same chemical getting you high basically.

It is the dmt that is getting you high the 4-ho lets it affect your body with 4-ho-dmt and with oral the MAOI lets it affect your body.

The different onset and way it metabolizes will give you a different high but still very similar in many ways.

There aren’t very may facts in this realm most of it is peoples opinions and theories.

Sense 4-aco-dmt started being researched it is changing a lot of peoples views on it. It was believed that 4-aco-dmt was converted to 4-ho-dmt but it has been giving people different affects sometimes similar to oral dmt. So it has a lot of people reevaluating their theories and ideas on the difference of dmt and 4-ho-dmt and 4-aco-dmt.

But I do believe that all 4-aco 4-ho and DMT all have the same chemical foundation, but each becomes different by the way it is introduced to the body and the way the body metabolizes it.

What does DMT and 4-ho-dmt turn into after it get in the body?
No one knows scientist are too busy studying bombs and Prozac.

[polymer]

What does DMT and 4-ho-dmt turn into after it get in the body?
psilocin passes through urine, unchanged... so does dmt (that has not been oxidized by mao in the gut). mass spec has confirmed this.