Buddhism vs Christianity

[Mindy]

What are your views on these two religions? I'm not trying to start any arguments but I hope to hear (in this case, it's "see") everyone's views. :)

I personally feel that there are both similarties and differences on these two religions.

Both taught human beings not to kill, steal, lie, not to be unchaste etc. These are the main similarities. Anyone has other views?

[peace_sells]

Buddhism makes more sense and is still very complex.

One of the main differences between the two is that Buddhism escapes the doctrine of "self". It is hard to understand this if you're a christian. It accepts that we are mortal and see's that believing in an afterlife as weak. bla bla bla.. I'd go on but I'm afraid I may bore the good Christians because they won't listen anyway (once again, if you're an "open-minded" christian. I dost apologise *removes hat*)

[TheProphetoftheWord]

Both are paths that may lead to the nexus of God. Choose not, for they are allies in pursuit.
Let the curiosity bestowed upon you by the Lord guide you; there are yet new paths to discover.

[peace_sells]

umm.. no. Not really.. how can Buddhists have a nexus to God when they don't believe in God? They believe (im speaking for most when I say this I presume) that there could be lots of gods that have no particularly great significance but play their part in nature etc

Also I have to add to the similarities and differences bit that buddhists are the only "religion" that haven't had a holy war.

[peace_sells]

oops sorry I didnt mean to say umm no :S that sounded harsh. Forgiveness if you please :) i dont know why I wrote that.

[AT98BooBoo]

Christ took our place and died the eternal death that we were supposed to die. Christianity teaches that we are not saved and made better people by our own efforts but we are saved and made better people by claiming Christs victory over sin(grace) and by having a continuing relationship with Him. The Christian God is one that is a personal being that loves us and cares for and about us. We don't have to keep trying and trying, to be good, hoping that in the next life we will get it right and escape. We believe that we only have one life to live. However in that one life we have a divine friend that is holding out his hand to us saying, you dont' have to do it all by yourself. Take my hand we will do it together.

[inbloom]

even though i'm not actually a buddhist, i believe in it more than i believe in christianity. i try to follow as much as i know about buddhism, as much as i can.

a christian friend of mine once told me that buddhism seems "LSD-ish." but, wouldn't christianity seem LSD-ish to a buddhist?

[inbloom]

Christ took our place and died the eternal death that we were supposed to die. Christianity teaches that we are not saved and made better people by our own efforts but we are saved and made better people by claiming Christs victory over sin(grace) and by having a continuing relationship with Him. The Christian God is one that is a personal being that loves us and cares for and about us. We don't have to keep trying and trying, to be good, hoping that in the next life we will get it right and escape. We believe that we only have one life to live. However in that one life we have a divine friend that is holding out his hand to us saying, you dont' have to do it all by yourself. Take my hand we will do it together.
but then, wouldn't christ and/or God still accept you, if you still believed in something else, while believing in him/them? cuz i believe in jesus christ, but i also believe in the buddha. in my opinion, they were two regular people who walked the earth like we do, but with more spitirual enlightenment, than the rest of us. my opinions on religion are very mixed, but i like it the way they are.

[BlackBillBlake]

Most buddhist schools believe that personal effort, meditation etc, is necessary in order to reach salvation. There are exceptions, for instance the Pure Land school of Japan, who believe it is solely reliant upon the saving grace of Amitabha Buddha. This seems on the face of it similar to Christian belief, but the big difference is in what is implied by the word 'salvation'.

For the Buddhist, salvation or nirvana means the ending of individual existence, which is seen as being of an illusory nature. The ego is disolved in the universal consciousness from which it originated.

Christianity on the other hand holds out the promise of a continuation of an individual existence lasting throughout all eternity, under conditions infinitely superior to those we experience now, in loving relation with God.

[loverofthewoods]

umm.. no. Not really.. how can Buddhists have a nexus to God when they don't believe in God?
.
the definition of "god" may be different, but thats where all spirituality leads.

[campbell34]

"but then, wouldn't christ and/or God still accept you, if you still believed in something else, while believing in him/them? cuz i believe in jesus christ, but i also believe in the buddha. in my opinion, they were two regular people who walked the earth like we do, but with more spitirual enlightenment, than the rest of us. my opinions on religion are very mixed, but i like it the way they are."


-Jesus says he is the only way. If Jesus is God what does that make budda? ...just a sinful person.

[FreakyJoeMan]

Righto, well then, back to balanced, thoughtful conversation...

[Fractual_]

i think buddhism was a litte more complex than the teachings of JC, jc just kinda layed down some good behavior and morals and all that. buddha was all about getting into the mind, and becoming truely aware.

[loverofthewoods]

-Jesus says he is the only way. no...christians say jesus is the only way

[campbell34]

loverofthewoods,

"no...christians say jesus is the only way"


Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

-John 14:6



http://r-campbell34.tripod.com/imagelib/sitebuilder/layout/spacer.gif

[LuciferSam]

If anyone knows about the Gnostics (the other major faction of Christianity that opposed the hierarchical mainstream Church in Roman times, before the Church gained power in the Empire and eradicated them), there's quite a lot of similarity between them and Buddhist thought. The Gnostics were into self-salvation, individual spiritual journeys, that stuff. They also had that notion of all material things being evil, etc. Though they were very dualistic, unlike the Buddhists, they believed in Plato's model of an abstract universe balancing out our physical one.

They're all interesting, although I could never buy their package, Gnostics or Buddhists. They've got too much asceticism and too dim a view of human nature for my liking. There were "libertine" Gnostics though, as opposed to ascetic Gnostics, who decided that since everything physical was evil, they'll just do whatever they please because it doesn't matter. Now those guys I kinda liked, a shame they got stomped out as well by the Augustinian Church.

[loverofthewoods]

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

-John 14:6



http://r-campbell34.tripod.com/imagelib/sitebuilder/layout/spacer.gifi think you completely missed my point....and i dont think bible quotes proove your point either

...also even if jesus did say that, that would be all the more reason for me not to follow his self rightous ways, one does not have to belive in christ to be a spiritual being....think about if someone were to say somthing like that today... they would be labeled a crazy and probably crucified as well



...i should really stop posting in the christian forums...:X

[campbell34]

you said Jesus did not say he was the only way, I gave you his words.... no misunderstanding

[Fractual_]

yeah i wouldnt quote jesus on that one...lol.

there are a lot of ways inside the way... if you know what i mean.

[Chodpa]

Christianity posits things which one must take on faith, Buddhism posits things which are evident. Christianity teaches that one can't have direct experience of the Supreme, Buddhism teaches that one is one with the Supreme or that no Supreme exists. Christianity teaches that actions lead permanently to heaven or hell once and for all time, after this life, and in stressing the afterlife more than life itself Christians feel free to destroy this very world in their idealistic zeal. Buddhism teaches that karma follows every action and so one can make life here and now heavenly, and if not through our own actions then through noones.

[BlackBillBlake]

Christianity posits things which one must take on faith, Buddhism posits things which are evident. Christianity teaches that one can't have direct experience of the Supreme, Buddhism teaches that one is one with the Supreme or that no Supreme exists. Christianity teaches that actions lead permanently to heaven or hell once and for all time, after this life, and in stressing the afterlife more than life itself Christians feel free to destroy this very world in their idealistic zeal. Buddhism teaches that karma follows every action and so one can make life here and now heavenly, and if not through our own actions then through noones.
Some schools of Buddhism seem to me to posit a great deal more than is 'evident' - Tantric Tibetan Buddhism for one example. Even in the story of the Buddha's enlightenment, supernatural supposed being appear, and there is much in the way of mythology, such as the Jakata stories etc.

Christianity does not really say one can have no direct experience of God. In the Bible itself, and in the voluminous literature of Christian mysticism there is ample evidence of a living experience of God. This has been the experience of many Christians over the centuries, and still is today.

As for Christian teaching placing more value on the afterlife than the here and now, Jesus said he came that his followers might have life 'more abundantly',
and that He is a God of the living, not of the dead'.

One could make a contrary assertion that Christianity has been and is more concerned to improve conditions in this world, whilst Buddhism is 'otherwordly' and seeks only an escape from the round of illusory existence into the absolute.

[LuciferSam]

It depends on the brand of either religion, I guess. I'm not an authority on it, but aren't the Pentacostals a group that has some belief in the direct experience of God? They're probably the closest the Christians have to a mystic sect.

One constant difference I think between the two religions is that Christianity tends to be dualistic while Buddhism is monistic. That is, Christianity generally espouses a belief in there being "another" world, in other words, Heaven and the spirit realm and all that. Buddhism on the other hand endorses a belief that there's just one world, "everything is one" sorta stuff, only that there are different ways of perceiving it or that there are levels of understanding to be transcended, so forth, so forth. At least that's my take, correct me if I'm wrong.

[inbloom]

^^^^ yeah, that's pretty much what i thought, too.


and campbell, people like you are the reason why so many people lose faith and interest in christianity. because of bible quoters who say anyone who does not follow jesus and follow through with every little demand he made, is a sinner. i, and many other people, don't want to be part of a religion that sets up such ridiculous rules to earn a place in heaven.

sure, there should be certain rules. i don't think everyone should be allowed to run around and do whatever they want, but some of the "rules" of christianity are just pointless. why is pre-marital sex a bad thing? who is it hurting? no one. and as long as it doesn't hurt anyone, or anything, you should be allowed to do it. things like that turn me off from christianity, sorry.

unless you're killing someone/something, or stealing from them, or causing them harm in anyway, where is the sin? i personally think jesus was just the original hippie, you know? he taught and practised the ways of peace and love, which extended to every living thing on the planet. i honestly don't think he ever asked for much, other than that. and i think people mis-interpreted his words along the way.

i've seen first hand how things like gossip, can go from your mouth, to your friend's, to his friend's, and to a bunch of guys he "kinda knows." it gets twisted around, and people include/exclude things to benefit themselves more, or make the story more interesting. it's human nature, and i think that's what alot of the bible is. i mean, c'mon. correct me if i'm wrong, but apparently the time between when all the stuff in the bible happened, to when someone actually started writing down, was like thousands of years!! don't you think, as that story got passed down through the generations, that it got switched around a little? c'mon. c'moooooon!

sorry. i'm not trying to insult you, or your beliefs. but, i would appreciate it, if you would respond in the same manner, and not call a figure i look up to as a "sinner." the buddha was a peaceful man, who never believed in forcing people to believe in his ways. he taught that you should leave people to their ways, and stay true to yours. nobody has to hate, just because they don't agree on their views on "God." whatever God is, we are all it's/his/her children, and we should just respect one another, for that.

peace

[BlackBillBlake]

It depends on the brand of either religion, I guess. I'm not an authority on it, but aren't the Pentacostals a group that has some belief in the direct experience of God? They're probably the closest the Christians have to a mystic sect.

One constant difference I think between the two religions is that Christianity tends to be dualistic while Buddhism is monistic. That is, Christianity generally espouses a belief in there being "another" world, in other words, Heaven and the spirit realm and all that. Buddhism on the other hand endorses a belief that there's just one world, "everything is one" sorta stuff, only that there are different ways of perceiving it or that there are levels of understanding to be transcended, so forth, so forth. At least that's my take, correct me if I'm wrong.
There are many Christian mystical traditions associated with the Catholic and Orthodox churches, I don't think Pentecostals have any monopoly here.

As for belief in other worlds, I am sure that Tibetan Buddhism teaches that there are many other worlds and planes of existence (see 'The Tibetan Book of the Dead').

[Cloudminerva]

Well, I follow many Christian, Hindu, and certain Buddhist views. My personal belief is that they piece together like a puzzle. They are philosophies that represent different spiritual aspects and realizations of God. Jesus helped me understand Krishna and the deites, then this helped me understand Buddha.


On my spiritual journey, I have found that in the end they do not contradict each other, they simply add together. Most contradictions, in my opinion, are due actually only to cultural differences with language and misenterpretation. Jesus opened my heart to find what love really is. That is the spiritual realization of this ascended master also known as Sandana. I was enlightened with love by the Christ and upon this realization, I became saved by the Christ. Hinduism and aspects of Buddhism taught me that God has many names that all bring light to the same spirit and that God can return to this Earth in different bodies with different names.

All the different philosophies reach out to us in different ways. Christ taught us that upon his realization we are saved from our sins and that love is the law. Krishna and the Hindu philosophies teach the same principle and they believe in Jesus' teachings. They teach us to concentrate upon ourselves and realize that God and the Holy spirit is within us and everything and that God is in fact distant and very personal simultaneously (within you without you). It has been said that Vishnu the preserver aspect of God descended to the Earth in the form of Krishna and Jesus to bring back the true discipleship of God. The Christian mystics who believed in the Perinneal Philosophy also believed this and Buddha was included with Jesus and Krishna in their teachings and beliefs.
Buddhism extends Hinduism further with teachings of controlling our desires. Hindusim teaches that our desires our good and natural but we must control them and use them for good and pure use. Buddhism teaches neither complete satifactions or psychological suicide, rather a middle path as stated with the Eightfold Path. The Buddha taught me the supreme aspect of completeness and wholeness and the beautiful ecstacy of nirvana that we can achieve within oursleves and how to keep this peace. Hinduism and Buddhism also taught me about Tantra, Kama Sutra, and later the Tao and how to truely appreciate love making by bringing forth upmost pleasure to your lover and the both of you realizing the ecstacy and beauty within yourselves and uniting with the spirit. Some people find this same state through abstinance... it just depends on what works for you when they accomplish the same goal:)

To sum this up Jesus helped me realize love, compassion, sympathy,open-mindedness and empathy.

Hinduism helped me realize the supremeness of God and the spirit of God present within everything as well as finding truth within ourselves, the discovery of our mind's eye,the ability of God to appear in different times with different names on earth, and concentrating on our desires and balancing our nature, realizing Brahman and the Atman within me. the everpresent OM.

The Buddha helped me realize inner peace and finding completeness in silence and the sounds that remain when all is silent...once again, the everpresent OM!

Please forgive me if I have misenterpreted or mixed up anything. Please do not be offended by what I say, just remember this is only what I have found for myself, my personal views. I have enjoyed this thread:cool:

Ben.

[Cosmic Butterfly]

a happy roggle to lift thy sou\]'l,zpleeze jump over the moon

[Cosmic Butterfly]

a happy roggle to lift thy sou\]'l,zpleeze jump over the moon

That was not me. My silly husband...

I think the Buddhism has greater teachings. We are the nexus of God, we are God. It is through realization that we may achieve mind/soul union. JESUS WAS A BUDDHA, and enlightened master...I feel that Christianity, and do not follow the truth. The Bible has alot of ego tossed in there, such as revenge, murder, sexism...To me it is quite obvious that a mere man who was not of pure essence wrote this book. What Jesus represents in modern Christianity is off centered.

[FreakyJoeMan]

OooOo! Is that yer froggle??

[inbloom]

That was not me. My silly husband...

I think the Buddhism has greater teachings. We are the nexus of God, we are God. It is through realization that we may achieve mind/soul union. JESUS WAS A BUDDHA, and enlightened master...I feel that Christianity, and do not follow the truth. The Bible has alot of ego tossed in there, such as revenge, murder, sexism...To me it is quite obvious that a mere man who was not of pure essence wrote this book. What Jesus represents in modern Christianity is off centered.
that's exactly how i feel, too.

[Cloudminerva]

I understand and feel the same way as well. There are some strange contradictions/situations in certain places in the Bible, but I believe Jesus to be a Buddha and an incarnate of the Vishnu aspect of God.


Peace,
Ben.

[phunkymonkey]

Originally posted by inbloom
why is pre-marital sex a bad thing? who is it hurting? no one. and as long as it doesn't hurt anyone, or anything, you should be allowed to do it. things like that turn me off from christianity, sorry.
There are probably quite a few people that wouldn't be hurt at all by pre-marital sex, but I think this was included in the Bible because a lot of people are. I have seen a lot of couples that got together, and after they had sex they stayed together for a long time even though they knew it was a bad relationship.

And without pre-marital sex you would proabably not have to worry about your partner having an STD... feel like you should marry someone because you are pregnant... have to raise a child on your own... & things like that. Now, I am not saying these things are on the rise today or that everyone will have these consequences, but I think it is hard to say that pre-marital sex hurts no one.



Originally posted by inbloom
i mean, c'mon. correct me if i'm wrong, but apparently the time between when all the stuff in the bible happened, to when someone actually started writing down, was like thousands of years!! don't you think, as that story got passed down through the generations, that it got switched around a little? c'mon. c'moooooon!

Sorry inbloom... I'm not trying to pick on you! But you did say to correct you if you were wrong http://www.hipforums.com/forums/images/smilies/wink.gif The first Gospels were not written a thousand years afterwards... not even one hundred years. It was about 40 years ~ and so a lot of people were still alive that had seen everything. At first they thought that Jesus had meant he was actually coming back soon, and so they did not feel the need to write anything down. Not to say some things still could have gotten switched around, but it was not just passed down from on person to another.

[inbloom]

even so, i've seen people who were actually there, during a certain situation i was at, and they totally change the story around when they're telling it to other people. why? to make themselves look better, or to gain some sort of acceptance from it.

and besides that point, the original bible was written in ancient latin. a language hardly anyone has spoken for years and years...a language so lost, they had a very difficult time enterpeting alot of it. so, who's the say they didn't just misread alot of the bible? you know how someone can say one thing, when they actually mean a completely different thing? if they're being sarcastic, or speaking metaphorically, or just telling a joke. maybe the bible was the original fiction novel??? maybe someone was having an amazingly creative idea, and decided to write it down and make it available to people. and then, as i said before, it started to get misinterpreted, over time. it could be possible. things could've been said that weren't exactly true, or were taken differently than they were meant to be taken.

i just don't think people should believe in something so blindly, such as a book, when it was created thousands of years ago, and the past on it is really shaky. that's just my opinion, though.

it's just something to wonder about, you know?

[BlackBillBlake]

even so, i've seen people who were actually there, during a certain situation i was at, and they totally change the story around when they're telling it to other people. why? to make themselves look better, or to gain some sort of acceptance from it.

and besides that point, the original bible was written in ancient latin. a language hardly anyone has spoken for years and years...a language so lost, they had a very difficult time enterpeting alot of it. so, who's the say they didn't just misread alot of the bible? you know how someone can say one thing, when they actually mean a completely different thing? if they're being sarcastic, or speaking metaphorically, or just telling a joke. maybe the bible was the original fiction novel??? maybe someone was having an amazingly creative idea, and decided to write it down and make it available to people. and then, as i said before, it started to get misinterpreted, over time. it could be possible. things could've been said that weren't exactly true, or were taken differently than they were meant to be taken.

i just don't think people should believe in something so blindly, such as a book, when it was created thousands of years ago, and the past on it is really shaky. that's just my opinion, though.

it's just something to wonder about, you know?
What makes you think that Buddhism has any advantage here? I don't think the majority of Buddhist sutras were written in the lifetime of the Buddha, and the propensity of people to reconstruct their memories would apply as much with Buddhism as with Christianity.
The greater part of the Bible was not written in Latin, but in hebrew and Greek. The Buddhist Scriptures are in Pali or Sanskrit.
And there is no evidence to suggest that Buddhist Ideas have not become distorted over time in the same way you say has happened with the Bible.

[phunkymonkey]

Originally Posted by BlackBillBlake
The greater part of the Bible was not written in Latin, but in hebrew and Greek.
I was just about to mention that! ;) The Old Testament was written in Hebrew & the New Testament in Greek. But I do agree with what you were saying about translations because it is very hard to translate the full meaning of things. I do know a lot of Christians who go back & study Greek so that they can understand it even better.

& I totally agree with you Inbloom that people should not believe in the Bible so blindly. I think even Christians should question if everything in the Bible is true.... automatically believing everything in the Bible is true without question requires the same amount of faith as automatically believing it is all false. When you questions something in the Bible you are more likely to actually think about the topic, do research on it, read the verses, talk to others & pray about it. I think there are a lot of Christians who never question anything & so they never learn what the Bible actually says.

[Brocktoon]

As a Christian, I always thought of Buddhism as being 'The next closest thing' mainly because of the shared 'Premise' of the state of Mankind.
That is to say, flawed and 'naturally' following the need for physical satisfaction through material ways. In a Nutshell - Pride.

Well anyway.. Buddha would have us believe that we can each meditate away our sinful natures and reach a state of 'Salvation' from the decaying physical world.
I simply dont agree.

I go with Jesus plan on this - Since he is the One to have solved the problem, we can vicariously have victory 'through Christ'.
(but not of ourselves).

But nowadays, most young people are interested in Buddhism because they are highly conditioned and trained into a 'Consumer' world-view.
They are choosing to identify themselves with the 'Buddha' product campaign because it 'Suits their lifestyle and image choice'.
- They see Buddhism as a convenient way. Requiring no confessions or accountablility.
No harsh 'definitions' to struggle with.
A way to gain enough spiritual 'comfort' without having to really 'do' anything or stand for anything.

And honestly - The Buddhists have done a remarkable job of promoting themselves.
Plus its a 'Honeymoon' phase in North America for them.

Interesting Topic!

[Cosmic Butterfly]

As a Christian, I always thought of Buddhism as being 'The next closest thing' mainly because of the shared 'Premise' of the state of Mankind.
That is to say, flawed and 'naturally' following the need for physical satisfaction through material ways. In a Nutshell - Pride.

Well anyway.. Buddha would have us believe that we can each meditate away our sinful natures and reach a state of 'Salvation' from the decaying physical world.
I simply dont agree.
I simply dont agree with what you said.Perhaps Christianity is more of what you said. That we can pray away our sinful natures and reach a state of "Salvation" from a decaying physical world. It is more than just meditation, it is also discipline. Controlling the ego, and compulsiveness. Realizing what and who you really are by removing the veils of illusionary preception of the world.
It takes years and years of practice, understanding, and putting your heart/spirit into things.

I go with Jesus plan on this - Since he is the One to have solved the problem, we can vicariously have victory 'through Christ'.
(but not of ourselves).
I believe/feel/know that Jesus is apart of us there for he is us. There is no seperateness. We can achieve what he has done through following his path of enlightenment and living simply without materialistic mindset. Helping others without return, giving and loving no matter what. Showing people that they are apart "GOD" they are "GOD" and they the power to do good.

But nowadays, most young people are interested in Buddhism because they are highly conditioned and trained into a 'Consumer' world-view.
They are choosing to identify themselves with the 'Buddha' product campaign because it 'Suits their lifestyle and image choice'.
- They see Buddhism as a convenient way. Requiring no confessions or accountablility.What you have seen was the silly consumer mindset on Buddha. A fad a phase, t shirts sold at trendy shops...silliness and more illusions. Buddhism is very very old and intense. It is false when you say that it requires no confessions or accountability. It is all about that. It is about diving into your essence and drudgin up all the confusions. Holding accountability for every single action, thought, and finding the root of it. It is like peeling away at an onion to find only at the center there is nothingness. And from this void all things are possible.


No harsh 'definitions' to struggle with.
A way to gain enough spiritual 'comfort' without having to really 'do' anything or stand for anything.

And honestly - The Buddhists have done a remarkable job of promoting themselves.
Plus its a 'Honeymoon' phase in North America for them.

Interesting Topic!
They did not intend to promote themselves. It was yuppies and came to the quite monks and asia to learn the secret teachings. And it was the yuppies who did the promoting and the "popularity fit". I feel ill when I also see the yoga trend today. It is so ridiculous and nothing near The Yoga of Knowng the Mind. They are just in it for the cash, the blondes, and the celebrities...Anyway, Its the yuppies who bring monks today into America and stuff money into their own bank accounts. Look at places like sedona. A bunch of rich yuppie Americans making MILLIONS of dollars on something that a baby knows and has no price.

Brocktoon, I reccommend that you take time to read a wonderful book. "The Tibetan Book of Living and Dying", it is also a great book for Christians as well. I think you would really enjoy it.

[Cloudminerva]

I could not agree with you more. Buddhism holds invaluable wisdom for Christians. And talk about harsh definitions and complexity...the Tibetan Book of the Dead is amazingly complex and beautiful. We can all learn from it.


Ben.

[Bambi]

What are your views on these two religions? I'm not trying to start any arguments but I hope to hear (in this case, it's "see") everyone's views. :)

I personally feel that there are both similarties and differences on these two religions.

Both taught human beings not to kill, steal, lie, not to be unchaste etc. These are the main similarities. Anyone has other views?

Well, for starters....you'd rarely catch a Buddhist getting into an us vs them debate. Buddhists love to debate, but without the vs.

The Bible is full of an eye for an eye stuff, killing, violence and the like. Buddhism teaches that these things create Karma, but in extreme circumstances, one may risk that Karma to save lives.

Both Buddhism and Christianity have an enlightened being coming to earth at about the same time, but the followers took very different paths. Buddhists took great pains to keep the original/authentic teachings just that: authentic. The Bible has been tweaked and worked to benefit those in power over the ages.

Buddhist teachings also benefit those in power, don't get me wrong, they just go about it differently. Christians are superohmygod attached, Buddhists are not, in theory at least. Christians seem to have the need to preach and convert...missionaries are a good example. Buddhists don't really care if you're a Buddhist or not.

I could go on and on....I'm a recovering Buddhist and Christian, so I feel I've had some experience. I do, however, still rely on my Buddhist training, whereas I feel I need therapy for my Christian training.

Interesting thread...thanks!!

Madame Bambi

[tiki_god7]

In my experiences through life I have come to conclude that christianity and buddhism both have it right.....the popular misconception is that the bible is taken too literally, its a guide book for a way to live a good life and nothing more.
Jesus was a bodhisittva (spelling?) or a 'buddha in training' his teachings were almost exact to that of buddha's. Jesus said he was god incarnate....people took at too literal and say the son of god like we think of a father and son relationship today. to buddha we are all the son of god with the potential to be a buddha, if we listen to his message and live a pure life and free ourselves of our wordly desires and by studying the tibetan book of the dead we can better understand what he means when saying that......
Baba Ram Dass wrote a beautiful book explaining it in a really easy to follow way(and if you're into hallucinogens he compairs the psychedelic experience to it very well) its called Be Here Now and I couldn't emphasize the beauty this book possesses enough other good reads on the topic are the politics of ecstasy(T. Leary) The psychedelic experience (T. Leary, which is an interpretation of the tibetan book of the dead)

oh yeah and for those who say buddhists don't have a God, I use the word god in refferance to the benevolant creator, the pure white light, the great energy force behind everything.

atleast that is my interpretation

[freakwentflyer]

Quote At98BooBoo- "Christ took our place and died the eternal death that we were supposed to die. Christianity teaches that we are not saved and made better people by our own efforts but we are saved and made better people by claiming Christs victory over sin(grace) and by having a continuing relationship with Him."

Why were we suppose to die an eternal death?
You Christians (most of you who take all that dogma literally) always cling to this idea. I can't subscribe to a religion that's centered around some foolish notion that sounds like some control freak (not meaning Jesus) pulled out of his ass to scare people into joining "his" church. It's no wonder you Christians are always having a "crisis of faith" every time the shit hits the fan.
Open you eyes.

I have faith. Pure faith. I don't need someone to give me answers, or promises of streets of gold. I don't need to be frightened into being good. "GOD" is man made. Just have simple faith in "whatever made you" and find balance in your soul. BALANCE is the key to all things. I'm not affraid of death. I have real true faith, blind faith. How can you say you have faith if you're always looking for miracles and words of comfort from religious authorities. Break away and be one with all that is.
Be what Jesus most likely REALY was. A simple man of faith, one with the spirit. Not the Jesus religion created.

[In The Moment]

Please forgive me if I have misenterpreted or mixed up anything. Please do not be offended by what I say, just remember this is only what I have found for myself, my personal views. I have enjoyed this threadhttp://www.hipforums.com/forums/images/smilies/cool.gif

Ben.[/QUOTE]

Not sure how to do this quote thing, but I want to say that I thoroughly enjoyed your post as well as the thread

I am on a spiritual journey that has recently taken me into an actual building they call a Church, its called a Unity Church. I didn't know what to think at first, I've lived so many years with Churchphobia that at first I wasn't sure if I'd make it through even one service. I've been to three now and feel I'm being open minded to accept new insights spiritually. It's not 'churchy' and they talk about all sorts of spiritual text (talmud, bible, koran) and my first service was actually not about anything but learning to see God in creation...(nature) and appreciate the beauty around us..

I spent many years in Church as a child (on my own, my parents did not attend). I think I did it to fit in with the neighborhood kids, but it never felt right. I spent hours, days, weeks and in the end a few years praying for some small amount of faith that I believed fueled others to believe. It never came. Today, I've also read some about Buddhism, Taoism, Wiccian, Native American Spirituality and I've come to my own personal understanding of faith. I've taken many things from all the things I've read, but more than anything I think I have learned to continue to grow in this human life as a more compassionate, loving, giving member of life. Live life on lifes terms, stay in the moment, stay out of my head and above all else LOVE.

I guess this wasn't really about ones own beliefs, but about something entirely different, but in my own personal study of different faiths this is where it's brought me so far. I am thrilled to be in the middle of my journey and am finally enjoying it every step of the way.

Namaste.
Sheila

[Bambi]

...snip
Jesus was a bodhisittva (spelling?) or a 'buddha in training' his teachings were almost exact to that of buddha's. en

You were close, it's bodhisattva. Bodhi is for the tree under which Buddha attained enlightenment. Bodhi means enlightnment, and sattva means essence.

I wouldn't say that their teachings were almost exact, nor would I say Jesus was in training. We don't know. Buddhists believe that each realm has its own Buddha; bugs even.

All a Buddha is, is one or that which has achieved the state of Buddha mind or awareness. There isn't one Buddha, there are millions. Tell a Christian that there a million Jesuses and you will likely be told you are an idol worshiper or something.

The Bodhisattva vow is one taken in the Mahayana form of Buddhism. The vow states that you will not "attain enlightment, until we all do." Sorta sucky, actually...tho' quite compassionate. I got tricked into taking it. Those Buddhists are tricky. '-)

There are three (some say 4 or more) main forms of Buddhism. Mahayana Buddhism is all about compassion. The Hinayana (Thervadan) and Vajrayana (Tantrayana)...some say Dzogchen or even Mahamudra Buddhism...are the other forms of Buddhism. They are quite different from Mahayana, but all forms contain elements of the other. No, Tantrayana isn't all about sex, as Westernern wanker wannabes would have you believe.

I'll happily go into the other forms of Buddhism if you care, if not...cool.

Frankly, from what I know of Jesus' teachings, I doubt if he would be a Christian, me might feel more comfortable being a Buddhist. But that's just my opinion.

[Kosmic_Klown]

The factioning of these and all religions is poison. Faith is just that Faith the way a person feels is perfectly all but when that becomes a damned country club then it all goes. And that goes for all these western "buddhist temples" too. Worship YOUR mesiah amongst the things he, she, or it created. Don't turn it into a spiritual AA meeting. (To clearify I stressed your not to offend but to point out that in end i'ts yours and mine and everyone elses religious icoms on individually not in classified groups.)

[Cloudminerva]

Thanks. I enjoyed your post as well!

Ben.



Please forgive me if I have misenterpreted or mixed up anything. Please do not be offended by what I say, just remember this is only what I have found for myself, my personal views. I have enjoyed this threadhttp://www.hipforums.com/forums/images/smilies/cool.gif

Ben.
Not sure how to do this quote thing, but I want to say that I thoroughly enjoyed your post as well as the thread

I am on a spiritual journey that has recently taken me into an actual building they call a Church, its called a Unity Church. I didn't know what to think at first, I've lived so many years with Churchphobia that at first I wasn't sure if I'd make it through even one service. I've been to three now and feel I'm being open minded to accept new insights spiritually. It's not 'churchy' and they talk about all sorts of spiritual text (talmud, bible, koran) and my first service was actually not about anything but learning to see God in creation...(nature) and appreciate the beauty around us..

I spent many years in Church as a child (on my own, my parents did not attend). I think I did it to fit in with the neighborhood kids, but it never felt right. I spent hours, days, weeks and in the end a few years praying for some small amount of faith that I believed fueled others to believe. It never came. Today, I've also read some about Buddhism, Taoism, Wiccian, Native American Spirituality and I've come to my own personal understanding of faith. I've taken many things from all the things I've read, but more than anything I think I have learned to continue to grow in this human life as a more compassionate, loving, giving member of life. Live life on lifes terms, stay in the moment, stay out of my head and above all else LOVE.

I guess this wasn't really about ones own beliefs, but about something entirely different, but in my own personal study of different faiths this is where it's brought me so far. I am thrilled to be in the middle of my journey and am finally enjoying it every step of the way.

Namaste.
Sheila[/QUOTE]

[BlackBillBlake]

You were close, it's bodhisattva. Bodhi is for the tree under which Buddha attained enlightenment. Bodhi means enlightnment, and sattva means essence.

I wouldn't say that their teachings were almost exact, nor would I say Jesus was in training. We don't know. Buddhists believe that each realm has its own Buddha; bugs even.

All a Buddha is, is one or that which has achieved the state of Buddha mind or awareness. There isn't one Buddha, there are millions. Tell a Christian that there a million Jesuses and you will likely be told you are an idol worshiper or something.
.
These millions of Buddha though, are all simply aspects and forms of the One underlying them all - the Dharma Kaya, or Adi-Buddha.

Christians believe they are 'children of God' by virtue of their belief and faith in Jesus, there is no need for there to be millions of Christs - one is sufficient.
Some Christians believe though in the existence of Angels - and their numbers may run into the millions....who can say?

[Bambi]

These millions of Buddha though, are all simply aspects and forms of the One underlying them all - the Dharma Kaya, or Adi-Buddha.

Christians believe they are 'children of God' by virtue of their belief and faith in Jesus, there is no need for there to be millions of Christs - one is sufficient.
Some Christians believe though in the existence of Angels - and their numbers may run into the millions....who can say?

True....but the Dharmakaya is a tricky one, because it represents the void or emptiness. Christians, at least the ones I know, don't seem comfortable with the concept of nothingness. I haven't seen the emptiness spoken of in the bible either, but I'm no bible expert.

The existence of Angels....I'm with you on that one!! I like how the Catholics just incorporated the local dieties into the club and made them saints....after the Roman custom. I'm for big parties myself.

[BlackBillBlake]

True....but the Dharmakaya is a tricky one, because it represents the void or emptiness. Christians, at least the ones I know, don't seem comfortable with the concept of nothingness. I haven't seen the emptiness spoken of in the bible either, but I'm no bible expert.

The existence of Angels....I'm with you on that one!! I like how the Catholics just incorporated the local dieties into the club and made them saints....after the Roman custom. I'm for big parties myself.
Some of the Catholic saints may well be older pagan or pre-christian deities incorporated into Christian belief. However, the vast majority are historical personalities.

Some christians may not be happy with the concept of God as anything but a personal being - but that does not go for all. A striking instance can be found in the mystical philosophy of Miester Eckhart.

My big question is this: if the Dharma Kaya is an emptiness, how could the cosmic manifestation have arisen? To say it is all illusion seems to be an easy way out, because we then have to ask how did this illusion come onto being? How could the perfect consciousness and knowledge have become subject to illusion?

[Bambi]

My big question is this: if the Dharma Kaya is an emptiness, how could the cosmic manifestation have arisen? To say it is all illusion seems to be an easy way out, because we then have to ask how did this illusion come onto being? How could the perfect consciousness and knowledge have become subject to illusion?

Ah, the eternal question '-D

Emptiness, Form. Form Emptiness. One cannot exist without the other. There cannot be form without emptiness, nor emptiness without form. Being sorta hemmed in on this plane of duality, it's difficult to perceive, because we see the yin/yang....but that's only two dimensional.

This is where mind expansion takes us beyond the nature of duality, or Nirmanakaya, then to the mystic or angel realm of the Samboghakaya, then on to the void....or mother...or creator...or emptiness: Dharmakaya.

This is how I experience and understand it.

Madame Bambi

[BlackBillBlake]

But I don't think the universe is an illusion - hence the peoblem doesn't arise, as it does for those who, like Buddhists, think it is.

[Bambi]

But I don't think the universe is an illusion - hence the peoblem doesn't arise, as it does for those who, like Buddhists, think it is.

I'm with you, BBB. I don't think the universe is an illusion. I think "illusion" may be just a syntax thing....meaning we cannot grasp it with limited vision....just a thought. Frankly, I think English is a very limiting language. Language affects our thoughts and other languages, more ancient....and indigenous....allow for much more expanded and deep concepts and experiences.

Madame Bambi

[BlackBillBlake]

I'm with you, BBB. I don't think the universe is an illusion. I think "illusion" may be just a syntax thing....meaning we cannot grasp it with limited vision....just a thought. Frankly, I think English is a very limiting language. Language affects our thoughts and other languages, more ancient....and indigenous....allow for much more expanded and deep concepts and experiences.

Madame Bambi
Yes - I agree that language brings in all sorts of limitations - true spiritual experience is beyond words, but if we want to talk about it , we have to use language, or symbols of some kind.

I would say that our view, our perception of the universe is indeed clouded by our conditioned mentality, we live in a world we view through a screen of imprinted language, cultural conditioning and limitation. This is the illusion. It is so dense in many to-day that they seem to have wholly lost contact with their own inner being. The way out of it is through transcendence - any path that can help in that is clearly of value, given the world's great need.

I am in no way against Buddhism, but I feel that many are seeking today for spirituality, and I am concerned that some professed Buddhists who criticise Christianity do so from a position of ignorance. They are only aware of the lower level manifestations of the thing, and know little of Christian mystical traditions. This is not so of the great Buddhist teachers like D.T.Suzuki, who in his 'Essays on Zen Buddhism' compares the two paths and discerns both the similarities and the points of departure.

In the end though, what matters is to follow a path that is suited to one's own individuality and that brings the desired result, of actual spiritual experience and the love and bliss that comes with it.

Love & Blessings

BBB.