Moving Server to USA?

Discussion in 'Site Announcements' started by skip, Apr 13, 2008.

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  1. stinkfoot

    stinkfoot truth

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    Whatever decision you make will be fine... My suspicion and distrust of the United States has me holding back from being completely enthusiastic about relocating servers and endorsing what makes the most sense from a fiscal standpoint.

    On that note I'd strongly urge that the love and sex section be revisited as far as what's going to be viewable by the general population... perhaps set a few of the subforums to have posts moderated as the images that show up in the body shot thread could be fodder for those with an agenda.
     
  2. skip

    skip Founder Administrator

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    I have considered moving the Real Kinky forum over to the Erotica forums but there is a lot of interesting information there that should be available to everyone.

    We just need to stay on top of ppl posting porn in the wrong place. There should be none visible to the general public in the Love and Sex forum.

    As you can see there really isn't even a need to alter our Guidelines if we move the server to the US because our guidelines already state that nothing illegal should be posted on the site.

    I will say the one noticeable difference between Dutch & US laws does concern the age of consent. I believe it is still set at 12 yrs old in the Netherlands (under specific circumstances). While it varies from state to state in the US. Plus the Dutch are just far more tolerant when it comes to sex, but things HAVE CHANGED a lot in Holland in the last few years since I moved from there. It's got way more conservative with a Christian MINISTER as the head of gov't. And the Dutch cooperate far more with US authorities than they did before, kowtowing to anything the US asks of them...

    So don't be so sure the Dutch will shield you. It will probably depend upon which US agency does the asking...
     
  3. neodude1212

    neodude1212 Senior Member

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    meh....

    I say move it. As long as nothing illegal is being done, I dont see why having the server here in the states would be a big deal.
     
  4. skip

    skip Founder Administrator

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    Well like others have said, IF anything illegal IS being done here, people doing it will be slightly more at risk.

    More than likely it's the same risk as before, except we all might have to monitor things more closely so that we comply with the law.

    But really the onus is on every member to know what is legal and illegal where they live and to comply with their local laws.
     
  5. zihger

    zihger Senior Member

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    I think now days a lot of people are either over paranoid of the U.S. or have a false sense of security in other countries. Yeah laws suck in the U.S…. but a lot of other countries have even less civil rights protection then the U.S.
    I haven’t been on this site very long and haven’t really looked at the sex categories so I don’t know much about any legal gray areas that might be going on, maybe an age disclaimer?

    I wouldn’t worry about it too much I haven’t seen to much on here that would attract much attention from LE.

    If people want a host in another country they can donate and make it happen.
     
  6. Shale

    Shale ~

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    The thing I liked about discovering this forum was seeing the community of young teens mixed with us old libertine farts. Now, I guess there could be potential for some old fart to try to make it with a young teen, but like you say that will happen anywhere and is not the responsibility of the site unless it is blatant and in a public forum.

    What I fear is the overreaction stuff that is so common in the US that the Dutch don't much bother with. I've seen too much of the overreaction on MySpace which succumbs to the lowest common denominator of prudery and deletes any pic that MIGHT be controversial (unless it is thru their own Drewpydraws - see my blog on MySpace Hypocrisy)

    So, some 13-year-old guy asks me a legit question on sexuality. "Sometimes I shoot off for 3 feet and other times it just oozes out - is that normal?" "While playing around with my G/F I got a pain in my balls and could hardly walk. What is wrong with me?" "Why is there a line in the middle of my ball sack?"

    I'm all for answering those and explaining in the most straightforward way what it is. There are some prudes who would object to a 60-year-old man communicating this to a 13-year-old boy. (I am a grampa and my own 13-yr-old grandson actually asked me one of those questions and I could talk candidly about those things with him - y'know the age-old role of the elder as a source of knowledge and experience).

    So, that is what concerns me about having any US oversight to this board. Actually, in a thread about testicular self exams, I did link to my Maintenance Manual for Male Private Parts, which is geared for guys who don't know about their body and it is on Literotica. Now that is an adult site, but apparently doesn't challenge a link to an article. The info I linked to is in a pamphlet that I distribute to anyone interested, regardless of age, because it is basically just educational material. But, you think someone would get bent out of shape over it?
     
  7. floydianslip6

    floydianslip6 Senior Member

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    I wouldn't worry about the move. It's easy for some users to sit around and fret and look out the window awaiting black ash and spiders to fall from the sky and signal the apocalypse. But I doubt that most of the users on here even gave a thought to where the server lived before you made this post.

    As you said in your OP, subpoena or not the gov will get its info whether it be by the letter of the law or not, so what's the dif? I was a webmaster of a private site for a while, we did what we could to lock down the site to the LEOs, what more can the end user ask?

    We can't be the internets beacon of security, as much as we'd like to be. Unless one of us wants to get a direct line and a ProLient server and host it ourselves we're always at the mercy of someone. I would say try to host with someone with a decent reputation.

    It's not like the server is going to move and the FBI is going to be dancing a jig and SSH'ing in all of a sudden.

    No worries here, keep up the good work.

    Ever looked at www.brinkster.com? I host a lot of sites there, they aren't bad.
     
  8. skip

    skip Founder Administrator

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    Floydianslip that hosting company doesn't even offer what we need in terms of dedicated server power.

    Well folks this doesn't look good. Although a lot of you want us to stay in Europe and I want to stay too, there doesn't seem to be enough financial support to pay for it.

    So unless someone puts a crowbar in an overstuffed wallet, all our sites will be moved to the USA to save on hosting fees...

    The difference in price between the Amsterdam and US servers is around $350 a month (which I would have to shell out of my own pocket in addition to what I do already). So unless we find a benefactor who can come up with that amount we will move soon.

    Let me know if you want to donate so I hold off on this move!
     
  9. coders333

    coders333 Member

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    skip, i have been wondering. what are the specs of the current server, also what sort of bandwidth does it take for this site.
     
  10. Captain Cannabis

    Captain Cannabis Banned

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    Can you move it anywhere else?
     
  11. skip

    skip Founder Administrator

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    I've already explained that this is the best deal I can find with a company that allows free speech. Servers and bandwidth costs lots more in other countries.

    We need the top of the line server (twin quad core xeons), 400 gigs a month at least (the one we're looking at offers 2000 gigs a month). I am sooooo damn tired of having to watch our bandwidth use every fucking day so we don't go over.
     
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  12. warmhands420

    warmhands420 curmudgeon

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    I will pledge $50 a month starting next month, May, I am going back to work after a year off and need to catch up on some things first. If 6 or more others can share the rest of the load.... Don't be fooled into thinking that the government is going to get better when the Democrats take over, it was a California Democrat that sponsored H.R.1955. If it does become law a lot of what I've read at Hip Forums will be illegal thought/speech. Do every thing you can to keep this site out of Uncle Sams reach. He is not to be trusted. Your not paranoid when they really are out to get you.;)
     
  13. neodude1212

    neodude1212 Senior Member

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    I really dont think the US will be all over you. Move it and save money man.
     
  14. skip

    skip Founder Administrator

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    Thanks for the offer, but the $350 difference must be paid EVERY month, as the shortfall from donations always comes out of my pocket EVERY month now. So it's not like a one time shot in the arm is going to cover our costs... That's not how it works. :(

    Deep pockets are needed on an ongoing basis. I was hoping our new MJ Guide would help cover costs (via advertising), but that's apparently not going to happen in time.

    As far as H.R. 1955 here's a summary:
    Please note what I bolded.
    10/23/2007--Passed House amended.
    Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act of 2007 - Amends the Homeland Security Act of 2002 to add a new section concerning the prevention of violent radicalization (an extremist belief system for facilitating ideologically based violence to advance political, religious, or social change) and homegrown terrorism (violence by a group or individual within the United States to coerce the U.S. government, the civilian population, or a segment thereof in furtherance of political or social objectives).
    Establishes within the legislative branch the National Commission on the Prevention of Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism to: (1) examine and report on facts and causes of violent radicalization, homegrown terrorism, and ideologically based violence in the United States; and (2) build upon, bring together, and avoid unnecessary duplication of related work done by other entities toward such goal. Requires: (1) interim reports and a final report from the Commission to the President and Congress on its findings and recommendations; (2) the public availability of such reports; and (3) Commission termination 30 days after its final report.
    Directs the Secretary of Homeland Security to establish or designate a university-based Center of Excellence for the Study of Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism in the United States to assist federal, state, local, and tribal homeland security officials, through training, education, and research, in preventing violent radicalization and homegrown terrorism in the United States. Requires the Secretary to: (1) conduct a survey of methodologies implemented by foreign nations to prevent violent radicalization and homegrown terrorism; and (2) report to Congress on lessons learned from survey results.
    Prohibits Department of Homeland Security (DHS) efforts to prevent ideologically based violence and homegrown terrorism from violating the constitutional and civil rights or civil liberties of U.S. citizens or lawful permanent residents. Directs the: (1) Secretary to ensure that activities and operations are in compliance with DHS's commitment to racial neutrality; and (2) DHS Civil Rights and Civil Liberties Officer to develop and implement an auditing system to ensure that compliance does not violate the constitutional and civil rights or civil liberties of any racial, ethnic, or religious group, and to include audit results in its annual report to Congress.

    So this bill only creates a STUDY of the matter. It does not set into law anything new restricting our freedoms that I can see in this summary. In fact it does PROHIBIT DHS from infringing upon civil rights & liberties, so that is a GOOD thing to have in the law.

    I don't see anything here that references the Internet, Freedom of Speech, etc. I really doubt this site could be viewed as encouraging violent terrorism. That would be more like a skinhead site.

    Of course this bill would need to be worked out with the Senate who might change some of the provisions. If there is more to this bill, please let me know.
     
  15. skip

    skip Founder Administrator

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    Ooops, I did see this line:
    `(3) The Internet has aided in facilitating violent radicalization, ideologically based violence, and the homegrown terrorism process in the United States by providing access to broad and constant streams of terrorist-related propaganda to United States citizens.

    That would definitely concern us!

    But that is simply a "finding" that led them to create this bill, which again is simply to STUDY the issue, and does not create new law or infringe further upon our current rights.
     
  16. Piney

    Piney Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    I would like to see more Hippies support the site.

    People, send in the $10.00 by pay pal.

    Understand how much Hip Forums will change if it becomes based in The US.

    This is a conforatable home for some working hippies, send in your support. Plenty of Moderators volunteering for free, show them you care.

    :hurray:
     
  17. neodude1212

    neodude1212 Senior Member

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    In what ways will it be changed?
     
  18. warmhands420

    warmhands420 curmudgeon

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    Skip, I was referring to the video posted by hippiehillbilly that explains HR 1955 better than I ever could. The offer of money is a pledge for each and every month. I'll take it out of my smoke budget. I will send the first payment on the first of May by paypal. I only signed on to paypal so I could make direct payments here. But if you decide the move to the states is in the sites best interest I'll go along for the ride. Q: What is the biggest lie most often told? A: I'm from the government and I'm here to help you.
     
  19. Pennyroyal_Tea

    Pennyroyal_Tea Member

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    As far as the law goes, if there's any discussion of illegal activity on here (dealing, using, etc.) plausible deniability. You can simply say that you posted for attention. They really would have burden of proof, which they wouldn't be able to provide if you didn't have anything on you.

    I dunno about the server being in the states...

    You actually need 400GB of bandwidth per month? Good God... How many sites are we talking here?
     
  20. skip

    skip Founder Administrator

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    This site and the galleries take up most of the bandwidth. Most of our slower sites that don't need to be overseas have already been moved off this server onto a cheap one in the states to allow more bandwidth for these two.

    In case you haven't noticed, HipForums traffic doubled in the last year. We now get way more than 1,000 simultaneous users during peak hours every day on just this site. Most sites with that kind of traffic with databases usually require two or more servers to do what ours does now. Fortunately the top-of-the-line servers can now handle that load, but ours hasn't been top-of-the-line for 4 years.
     
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