Communist party USA

Any one a member or suporter? Opinions? Lets discuss communism in America.

 

Communism is pretty terrible, I'm not talking about in practice I'm also talking about in theory. It completely disregards all of human nature and can never work on any more than a very small, i.e. commune type level.

 

Explain?

Edit: What makes it so inhuman in nature. You said yourself that it works in a small commune typ level. Is sacioty not just mass communes of people?

 

Communes work because they're tiny plots of land populated only be people who share the same exact belief. Anything can work when everyone has the same exact beliefs. The vast majority of people though don't want to share everything equally. People get jealous, people want more, they scheme, plan, work, cheat, whatever to gain more. To quote the movie Wall St.(and real life Wall St.), greed is good. It drives innovation, it drives invention, it drives production. Literally a good deal of human history has been individuals trying to acquire more for themselves. It's not a symptom of society, it's a transference of basic needs, material goods and currency in the modern world fill our need for security since they provide the means for food, warmth, sex, comfort, whatever you be it. Greed is good man.

*edit*
Greed is good, but greed should be regulated and spread around to an extent for the sake of human decency.

 

Well, from what i understand communism is NOT everything being shared equally. But rather the workers owning the means of production. Meaning the the fruits of there labor belongs to them. From what i can tell your view is that communism is ran by the state and that everything flows from the top down as in such countrys like russia in china in the height of there communist governments. However you COULD argue that they were not true communist countrys more or less just totalitarian states. In a state with actual text book implemented communism the only thing the people would get eqaully ecanomicaly would be a percentage of the total profit from say a company they work with since the fruits of there labor would be there property. There would still be "greed" or rather ecanomic incentive to work harder and progress as the calloctive people of a corp. would get eqaul share of the $. Personally implemented with democrocy i could see communism flourishing in the U.S.

does it still completely disregard all of human nature?

 

the problem with communism in the usa is that everyone interprets the ideology based on communism as it was practiced historically [and badly] in the soviet union, china, cambodia, cuba, wherever

and ignores the theories of karl marx - the theories that the soviets, chinese, khmer rouge and fidel ignored too

does human nature preclude some theories from ever being practiced properly?

 

I once was a card carrying member of CWA local 3204.
Just where in America is Communism being practiced? Are we talking of Communism as a form of government? If so, can you still call it Communism?
Communism tends to be workable only in small societies where the members share a closely related kinship, and have access to little more than the bare essentials of life. Most of such societies have been eliminated by modern societies today. Perhaps a few still exist deep in the Amazon? Socialism is the stage where government stalls in the attempt to achieve Communism, and will continue to be as large populations can not do without some form of government, and true Communism can not be achieved with the existence of government.

 

What are you on about mate. Communism is the very basic concept of equality.Cuba, a communist nation, has no homeless people, a higher literacy rate than the U.S. and a health care system that Americans should envy. Communism is not only about totalitarian control of a nation, which is what Stalin put into action. Communism is about providing everyone with education, food, health care, and leisure. It is about a secular state, where everyone is the same, and gays aren't treated badly, or abortions are considered crimes and the death penalty is allowed.

 

There are a lot of good ideas within this discussion. Pardon me for interjecting....I hasten to put myself under the label of any "ism"--but I have always felt very much close to the ideals of Communism, and also some aspects of Socialism. I am hardly a political science scholar. It just seems to me that government is more of a hinderance than a help. I don't know what else to say other than every country I have ever visited--and I have been to A LOT, there are always complaints and gripes about the government systems within that particular country. The older I get, the more I realize that it's not about what political ideology you support or feel a kinship towards, it's about common human respect and compassion, which, unfortunately, I think is lacking throughout a lot of the world, but especially in the more developed countries. In the end, if we can't put our differences aside to help one another and hold each other up during tough times, we have lost hope and definition as a society and it truly doesn't matter what "ism" our government falls under.

 

WTF??? I enter the conversation and then it ends. hahaha It's like my interjection was a expulsion of gas which caused a swift exit. Sorry, comrades.

 

The problem with economics is that everything is assigned value arbitrarily based on human whim and thus there are families that don't have the net worth to buy clean water with your pocket change

I suspect that much supporters of capitalism and other sloppy applications of human nature are mostly just comfy where they, personally, stand in it

 

Humans are, by nature, materialistic and want to "own" things.

Having an understanding that you don't REALLY own jack is fine. Trying to base a society around it is beyond foolish.

Communism appeals to people who stand to get more from it, and ONLY because they stand to get more from it. Then after they usher it in, they realize they only stand to be purged like everyone else.

The sane twin of communism is socialism. And unlike communism, which also involves burning all the bridges OUT of communism, socialism only requires friendly government policies, if you decide you want to go back to being the current fascist america, you can just repeal the socialist stuff.

 

It's all just a Glorified Board Game to me.

I can't care to hard about it because it's mostly nonsense

But on a GLOBAL SCALE it's destructive so it's always a good idea to consider REfashioning it

The reason the MARKET requires unmitigated growth is to keep money at the top

Civilization is a sloppy mess of human nature whether we enjoy it or not

 

Who said you don't own jack in communism? I'm fairly sure in communism like socialism YOU own the rights to your labor. Correct me if I'm wrong. Anyhow economical statism(fascism) and economical communism are two very different things. Only one has really been implemented fully in human history.

 

Cuba's communist model is somewhat skewed by the US boycotting and blockades. Would it be a different state had we open trade?
Why did Cambodia not succeed?
China's not so much Communism more like central planners with a stanglehold on political parties and unions.
Russia failed due to competition with US arms race. So, they to were skewed in their possibilities.

 

YOU don't own anything.

The community owns everything.

The government owns all money, property, etc. there may be no clear ownership of individuals, but their use or prescribed work is determined by the "greater good". And once the labor's been done for the government, it sure as hell ain't the individuals anymore, is it?

Communism involves having absolute faith in the government. If a government of men could deserve absolute faith, then we could at least talk about communism without being silly.

Also, communism and fascism are opposite sides of the same coin, and I don't give a shit what each says about the other. Communism beyond the size of a family or SMALL tribal unit, DEPENDS on fascism. You must absolutely support the state, and all be of exactly the same opinion on things. If someone is out of line, they are bent back into line, for the sake of preserving a strong state. Fascism.

A communist government may say that you own the rights to your labor. And that might be true, to the extent that you can refuse to work. And if you refuse to do what the "community" tells you, you will not have food, shelter, etc. So you have the freedom to be free and dead, or do as you're told and deal with it. There is no way to just opt out and not do what you're told, because the government CONTROLS the economy: they own the money, they decide how the money's spent, and they decide how much you have. You can't say "oh, I'll just be independently wealthy and not work", because wealth is redistributed so that you HAVE NONE. You do as you're told, or die, by hunger or the hand of the government.

Communism's name says it all: it's about the community. Socialism is the TRUE opposite of communism and fascism. Socialism puts the individual first, and uses the strength of a free but supportive society to keep the individual safe. Communism uses the strength of all the individuals to keep the society safe. Guess which one breeds resentment? Oh yeah, the one that stomps on it's people for the sake of the power hungering nature of a small council.

Socialism is on one side, capitalism is a broad spectrum of many variables in the middle, and communism and fascism are different names for the same side, opposite socialism.

 

I’d like to ask you were your sources are that informed you about all this. I'm not saying you’re wrong but I have read allot of marxes work and ideally real communism doesn’t have government. As he states.

 

I've always found the movie "The Gods Must Be Crazy" to be the best example of a working form of communism, but how many of us would find that life style acceptable?

Communism can only succeed by the elimination of human production which cannot be shared equally on a daily basis, living each day as it is the last.

Communism as a form of government results in the acceptance or forced acceptance of living within the means allowed by those who can maintain the power to rule as they wish which results in the government defining equality which can vary greatly within the society, and is in reality Socialism, not Communism.

No form of government can eliminate private ownership completely as people will always find ways to hide things from the knowledge of others, including that of government. One mans trash is another mans treasure, and all it takes is for more than one man to take the same view. It is difficult if not impossible to control all of societies wants to a single value. Even the greatest necessities of life, such as food can result in division, more so in a large society than in just a very small community. Not all people like the same foods equally, and preferences can be difficult to resolve in ways acceptable to all.

In the end, there is no best form of government which could be made acceptable to all. There will always be those who prefer little or no government and those who prefer government to intervene on their behalf. Society is, and always will be, comprised of both those who are independent and those who are dependent. Ideally we should strive to reduce the number of the latter.

 

I'm not talking about marx's work. I'm talking about in reality/practice, which has basically nothing to do with his work.

For once, I agree with individual: read the first paragraph of his post.

If there's a handful of people, communism is great. My family is heavily communistic in it's functioning, as are pretty much all functional families.

But trying to apply communism to government, or to force it on people, is absolute blind stupidity or a bid for power, depending on which side of the "stupid" fence you're standing on during the revolution.

I've repeatedly started and never finished the communist manifesto. I found it exceedingly dry, boring, and wordy without saying very much.

Yeah, the concept is cool. Again, for a family unit. But not for government.

 

A good book about this is Animal Farm by George Orwell. But in a nutshell, Communism doesn't work because people will not work as hard for the benefit of strangers as they will for themselves or their families. Think about it. Let's say they told you in school that you would get a C no matter how well, or how poorly you did on tests and homework, but that you should work hard anyway because it's the right thing to do. This would make all students equal. But it would also remove all the incentive to work hard. It's the same with Communism. Why break your back at work? You won't make any more or any less than anyone else.

Cuba is communist yet the society doesn't give people incentive to do anything. You don't need to try or become someone when the government gives you everything to live. There is no merit being rewarded. You don't need to work in a communist state when you get the same treatment when you don't work. Rewarding no merit is horrible and will breed people to not try hard. You don't need to try hard if it's guaranteed.

And how equal is it in Cuba as everyone lives in poverty as the Dictator lives like a King.